Inquiries and Impeachment of Trump

Supreme Court will take up Trump’s broad claims of protection from investigation

The Supreme Court on Friday agreed to decide whether President Trump may shield disclosure of his financial information from congressional committees and a New York prosecutor, raising the prospect of a landmark election-year ruling on a president’s immunity from investigation while he is in office.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...7a1_story.html

The fat lying bastard is having a bad day Originally Posted by Jaxson66
The specific article you cited is behind the WAPO's paywall so I'm not sure of it's details.

But I'm unclear why you would say this is bad for Trump. Most of the lower court rulings have been against Trump. That that SCOTUS didn't either toss it right back to them or summarily say they wouldn't hear the case and the lower court rulings all stand would have been bad.
dilbert firestorm's Avatar
I’ll consider your wager once the Senate is ready for trial. Little bit early for me. Originally Posted by Jaxson66

if ya say so...


Mooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!
dilbert firestorm's Avatar
Supreme Court will take up Trump’s broad claims of protection from investigation

The Supreme Court on Friday agreed to decide whether President Trump may shield disclosure of his financial information from congressional committees and a New York prosecutor, raising the prospect of a landmark election-year ruling on a president’s immunity from investigation while he is in office.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...7a1_story.html

The fat lying bastard is having a bad day Originally Posted by Jaxson66
Supreme Court will take up Trump’s broad claims of protection from investigation


By Robert Barnes
Dec. 13, 2019 at 6:28 p.m. CST

The Supreme Court on Friday agreed to decide whether President Trump may shield disclosure of his financial information from congressional committees and a New York prosecutor, raising the prospect of a landmark election-year ruling on a president’s immunity from investigation while he is in office.

Trump asked the court to accept the cases, and they will be heard in March, with a ruling before the court’s session ends in late June. It means that whatever the outcome of Trump’s separate impeachment proceedings, the controversies over investigations into Trump’s conduct will continue into the heart of the presidential election campaign.

Manhattan District Attorney Cyrus Vance Jr. and three Democratic-led congressional committees have won lower-court decisions granting them access to a broad range of Trump’s financial records relating to him personally, his family and his businesses. The court on Friday said it would consider all three cases.

Unlike other modern presidents and presidential candidates, Trump has not released his tax returns. He and his personal lawyers have mounted a vigorous effort to keep that information private and defeat attempts to obtain the records from financial institutions and his accounting firm.

“We are pleased that the Supreme Court granted review of the President’s three pending cases,” said Jay Sekulow, a lawyer for Trump, in a statement released Friday. “These cases raise significant constitutional issues.”

In a statement, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) signaled disappointment that the high court’s decision to take the cases would mean further delay for the Democrats’ investigation into the president’s finances, but she said her caucus remains confident that the court will “uphold the Constitution, the rulings of the lower courts and ensure that Congressional oversight can proceed.”

“As the Courts have made clear,” Pelosi said, “there are no special privileges for information unrelated to the President’s official duties, but squarely related to Congress’s need for legislation and oversight.”

The Supreme Court’s decision to get involved represents a historic moment that will test the justices and the Constitution’s separation-of-powers design. It is the first time the president’s personal conduct has come before the court, and marks a new phase in the investigations that have dogged his presidency.

The Supreme Court’s action came the same day a House committee approved articles of impeachment against the president, but these issues do not concern that process. It does add another potential blockbuster ruling to a Supreme Court term that already contains politically controversial cases on abortion, gun rights, the fate of undocumented “dreamer” immigrants brought to the country as minors and whether federal civil rights laws protect LGBT workers.

The court includes two Trump nominees, Justices Neil M. Gorsuch and Brett M. Kavanaugh, and it will draw inevitable comparisons with the dramatic decisions on presidential power the court rendered against Presidents Richard M. Nixon and Bill Clinton. In both cases, justices they had nominated to the court voted against them.

The committees and Vance had told the Supreme Court that the subpoenas followed long-established precedents, and there was no need for delay. But the justices traditionally are solicitous when a president raises questions concerning the separation of powers.

Trump’s lawyers told the court that the lower-court rulings were wrong, and that prosecutors and congressional committees should not be allowed to launch wide-ranging investigations of the president, especially without the Supreme Court’s review.

One case involves Vance’s attempt to enforce a grand jury subpoena issued to the president’s accountants for eight years of Trump’s tax records.

A federal investigation of the president is one thing, Trump’s lawyers told the court, but “politically motivated subpoenas like this one are a perfect illustration of why a sitting president should be categorically immune from state criminal process.”

They added: “State and local prosecutors have massive incentives to target [the president] with investigations and subpoenas to advance their careers, enhance their re-election prospects or make a political statement.”

A district judge and a panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 2nd Circuit ruled against Trump, saying Vance’s subpoena was proper and the president’s longtime accounting firm, Mazars USA, must comply.

Vance’s office had agreed to hold off on enforcing the demand until the Supreme Court decided whether it would get involved.

Vance has said his office needs the records for its investigation into alleged hush-money payments made during the 2016 presidential campaign to Stormy Daniels, an adult film actress, and to former Playboy model Karen McDougal. Both women said they had affairs with Trump several years ago, and Vance’s office is examining whether any Trump Organization officials filed falsified business records, in violation of state law, related to the payments. Trump has denied the affairs and any wrongdoing.

Vance told the Supreme Court in opposing Trump’s petition that “there is no real public interest at stake here at all; this case instead involves (Trump’s) private interest in seeking his own and others’ immunity from an ordinary investigation of financial improprieties independent of official duties.”

Trump attorney William S. Consovoy has argued that while in the White House, Trump has “temporary presidential immunity” not just from prosecution, but also from investigation. At the appeals court hearing in New York, Consovoy said in response to a judge’s question that the president, for as long as he is in office, could not be investigated even for shooting someone on the streets of Manhattan.

The 2nd Circuit disagreed, saying the prosecutor’s request was not out of the ordinary and that the president did not even have to take action to comply.

“The only question before us is whether a state may lawfully demand production by a third party of the president’s personal financial records for use in a grand jury investigation while the president is in office,” wrote Chief Judge Robert A. Katzmann.

He added in a footnote:
“We note that the past six presidents, dating back to President Carter, all voluntarily released their tax returns to the public. While we do not place dispositive weight on this fact, it reinforces our conclusion that the disclosure of personal financial information, standing alone, is unlikely to impair the president in performing the duties of his office.”

The House Oversight and Reform Committee won access to Trump’s financial records in a separate case. The committee said it is looking into possible conflicts of interest and irregularities in the president’s financial disclosure reports, and whether additional legislation is needed.

A panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit voted 2 to 1 that the subpoena followed legal precedents.

Trump’s lawyers objected. Under the lower court’s decision, “any committee of Congress can subpoena any personal information from the president; all the committee needs to say is that it’s considering legislation that would force Presidents to disclose that same information,” wrote Consovoy. “Given the temptation to dig up dirt on political rivals, intrusive subpoenas into personal lives of presidents will become our new normal in times of divided government.”

A third case also comes from the 2nd Circuit, where judges upheld Congress’s broad investigative authority, and ordered Deutsche Bank and Capital One to comply with subpoenas for the president’s financial information from two House committees, Intelligence and Financial Services.

The committees are seeking more than 10 years of financial records on Trump, his three oldest children — Eric Trump, Donald Trump Jr. and Ivanka Trump — and the president’s businesses.

The committees say they need the records as part of broad investigations into Russian money laundering and potential foreign influence involving Trump.

Trump’s attorneys have argued the committees’ moves are simply to harass the president and would serve no legislative purpose. The subpoenas could yield every debit card transaction and check written by Trump, his children and even his grandchildren, they said.

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Robert Barnes
Robert Barnes has been a Washington Post reporter and editor since 1987. He joined The Post to cover Maryland politics, and he has served in various editing positions, including metropolitan editor and national political editor. He has covered the Supreme Court since November 2006. Follow
eccieuser9500's Avatar
Supreme Court will take up Trump’s broad claims of protection from investigation


Trump’s attorneys have argued the committees’ moves are simply to harass the president and would serve no legislative purpose. The subpoenas could yield every debit card transaction and check written by Trump, his children and even his grandchildren, they said.

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Robert Barnes
Robert Barnes has been a Washington Post reporter and editor since 1987. He joined The Post to cover Maryland politics, and he has served in various editing positions, including metropolitan editor and national political editor. He has covered the Supreme Court since November 2006. Follow Originally Posted by dilbert firestorm
This is pretty much the only paragraph that matters. It's getting down to the nitty gritty. Emoluments and separation of powers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqOnkiQRCUU

Destiny? Or providence?









Jaxson66's Avatar
The specific article you cited is behind the WAPO's paywall so I'm not sure of it's details.

But I'm unclear why you would say this is bad for Trump. Most of the lower court rulings have been against Trump. That that SCOTUS didn't either toss it right back to them or summarily say they wouldn't hear the case and the lower court rulings all stand would have been bad. Originally Posted by eccielover
Well, I’m considering the floor debate in the House prior to the vote. I’m thinking Pelosi will call for a prime time vote, if she opens the floor for 8 or 9 hours of floor debate I’m thinking the Committee Chairpersons will be on the floor asking the country “ what is the fat lying bastard hiding “ .

There might be Reps who ask why the SC is placing his case on the docket before gun control when he loses case after case in the lower courts. Individual one will likely be brought up on the House floor and I can’t see how that benefits trump.

Impeachment isn’t a court of law it’s a court of public opinion and the country is the jury. Will the floor debate move public opinion? In the far left and right the answer is, No! But there’s lots of voters who claim their undecided that might be swayed one way or the other. Then there’s the citizens who may be moved to vote for the first time in their lives.

One reason I didn’t accept your wager, I’m gathering more information.
rexdutchman's Avatar
Well, I’m considering the floor debate in the House prior to the vote. I’m thinking Pelosi will call for a prime time vote, if she opens the floor for 8 or 9 hours of floor debate I’m thinking the Committee Chairpersons will be on the floor asking the country “ what is the fat lying bastard hiding “ .

There might be Reps who ask why the SC is placing his case on the docket before gun control when he loses case after case in the lower courts. Individual one will likely be brought up on the House floor and I can’t see how that benefits trump. Originally Posted by Jaxson66
So basically wishful thinking on your part that it's detrimental to Trump. Thanks to Dilbert posting your full article, it is clear that Trump wanted the SCOTUS to take it up and other articles I have read, reference the request as an emergency request as the House is trying to use it as a political cudgel against the POTUS.

The answer for anyone is that it is entirely appropriate for the SCOTUS to take the emergency request and hear the case in short order.

Impeachment isn’t a court of law it’s a court of public opinion and the country is the jury. Will the floor debate move public opinion? In the far left and right the answer is, No! But there’s lots of voters who claim their undecided that might be swayed one way or the other. Then there’s the citizens who may be moved to vote for the first time in their lives. Originally Posted by Jaxson66
I totally agree and the court of those who claim undecided, largely the independents out there have already moved their opinions to the House impeachment being the circus that we all know it is and disapprove of the proceedings. That's driving the left absolutely ape-shit that their bullshit has moved the needle in the wrong direction over the last months.

One reason I didn’t accept your wager, I’m gathering more information. Originally Posted by Jaxson66
I call bullshit on that. You tried to throw me a sucker bet that didn't match my posts in that the House would impeach, so I returned the favor. You and I both know the current articles, if both even make it to the Senate will not get Trump removed from office. Just admit it that you are going to be severely disappointed when Trump doesn't get removed.
  • oeb11
  • 12-14-2019, 10:22 AM
j666 still believes Impachment of Trump= H.... installed as POYUS!
DPST's revile our Constitution and Bill of Rights because it interferes with their narrative how "things should be"!
Jaxson66's Avatar
I’m 99% sure the House of Representatives will impeach the fat lying bastard. So I’m far from disappointed at this point. I do want the Senate to remove him from office but that’s unlikely, but it’s not etched in stone.

Unless you’re the 21st century Edgar Casey you can’t see the future any better than me. All I know for certain is the far right trump party wants no impeachment and no trial and doesn’t give a shit what he’s done. Then there’s a group who will claim its Whitey giving Whitey another pass because of racism in the Senate, allied with a the group who wants him removed from office because of the constant bullshit of the last three years and his attacks on the Constitution.

I’d prefer he resign and allow Pence to assume office before this goes any further for the good of the country. But he won’t because he doesn’t care about the country he cares about himself period.

Btw, there can be another wager other than acquittal or conviction. I talking the vote count in the senate. Im doubting the vote will be as partisan as you might think. There may be more senator votes for removal than you think.
Jaxson66's Avatar
j666 still believes Impachment of Trump= H.... installed as POYUS!
DPST's revile our Constitution and Bill of Rights because it interferes with their narrative how "things should be"! Originally Posted by oeb11
You’re a goddamn liar, you don’t know me.
  • oeb11
  • 12-14-2019, 11:23 AM
J666 "knows" he knows what trump thinks and beleives.

And "knows me"!


I am not Edgar Casey - and j666 only thinks he speaks for the minds of all others as the authoritative source mind-reader.

Please post your "outrage"!


j666- Then there’s a group who will claim its Whitey giving Whitey another pass because of racism in the Senate, allied with a the group who wants him removed from office because of the constant bullshit of the last three years and his attacks on the Constitution.
Why not post a reference and source for the "Racist " accusations - the racism is in the DPST party plantation politics. Think they own their "minorities".

Might be referring to the notoriously open minded and impartial and non - racist Omar and Tlaib led faction. They are such dearies to others - unless One is white /Jewish!
Jaxson66's Avatar
J666 "knows" he knows what trump thinks and beleives.

And "knows me"!


I am not Edgar Casey - and j666 only thinks he speaks for the minds of all others as the authoritative source mind-reader. ! Originally Posted by oeb11
You’re a goddamn liar, you don’t know me.

If you had 1% of Edgar Casey’s gray matter, you would know what a fucking moron you are..go away little man.
  • oeb11
  • 12-14-2019, 11:54 AM
Says One who promised to not engage in discussion any longer.

Cannot give up the smug arrogance, j666
Chung Tran's Avatar
You’re a goddamn liar, you don’t know me. Originally Posted by Jaxson66
this should be a "sticky" that can be clicked on, and inserted into a post, easily. it exactly fits 70% of the responses I give, I could click on this and save myself time and excessive wordiness.
Jaxson66's Avatar
We’ve seen enough’: More than a dozen editorial boards call for Trump’s impeachment

The opinions of major publications are divided as the House prepares for a historic vote Wednesday, and a host of traditionally more-conservative editorial boards have yet to weigh in — including several that snubbed Trump in 2016 by conspicuously breaking from long histories of Republican endorsements.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arts-...h-impeachment/