Political Discussion thread

janet Napolotano?

shed rip your dick off and spit it on the floor

guess if you want to find me after wednesday, look in gitmo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEgP4...eature=related

RPGs where US issue
Ambassador Chris Stevens gay

So not buying quoted part of your post. Then Oblama blames it on a youtube clip. ya right Originally Posted by offshoredrilling

Part of the problem in a discussion like this is that facts and reason that don't support the pre-conceived/desired conclusion don't get much consideration. The other is that facts presented as de facto proof without analysis are pretty meaningless....they are the equivalent of "I know you are, but what am I?".

Still, let's give it a shot.

RPG's are not in the US arsenal. They are former Warsaw Pact weapons, like AK-47s. It's certainly possible that the attackers got their hands on weapons that at one time were provided by the US to someone we supported. Before we started equipping the Afghan National Army with NATO weapons, we supplied them with AK's and RPGs and the like. As much as we are attempting to destroy all the WP weapons as we NATOize the ANA, some of that stuff will probably fall off the truck. My question is, so what? Unless you are suggesting that the Obama administration specifically provided weapons to the attackers and tasked them with conducting the attack, then anything else regarding the origins of the weapons is irrelevant. The country just went through a civil war where all sorts of folks and factions had the chance to get their hands on weapons. I just can't see how that reflects on our foreign policy. Stuff like that has been happening throughout the modern era regardless of who sits in the White House. How is this reality the fault of President Obama?

As for the Ambassador's sexual orientation...at best it's a rumor, but let's pretend for the moment that he was. The guy had been serving in diplomatic posts in Northern Africa for quite a while, and apparently had a sufficiently stellar career that he got the Ambassadorship...don't see the problem. It's just not credible that such a concerted attack was about that...it doesn't survive any kind of careful scrutiny. Besides, the guy wasn't even attacked directly. His death was a result of asphyxiation from smoke inhalation while hiding in his safe room. He didn't even die at the consulate, but later at a Libyan hospital. It stands to reason that he was not the focus of the attack, although it was initiated during his visit, so can't rule it out.

As for whether an Ambassador can be gay or not, I get that the pro-discrimination folks would have a problem with that, but considering that President Obama had just got done eliminating Don't Ask, Don't Tell, it would be hypocritical to discriminate for the same thing at the State Department.

Finally, the dude was probably straight anyway.

As for the video factor; while preliminary reports seemed to tie the motivation for the attack to a similar event in Cairo that was sparked by the anti-muslim movie, those conclusions have long been discarded, so it's not even close to being accurate to assert this far along that the President of the United States is blaming the attack on the reaction to the video.

I'm left with the reality that, in time when we are in armed conflict with terrorist elements who are mostly Islamic extremists, one of the factions with whom we are at war launched an attack at one of our consulates. When you are at war, it's not entirely surprising that your enemy will mount an attack from time to time. Still not getting how that particular reality of armed conflict reflects in any particular way on President Obama.

I'm travelling abroad and do not have time to contribute, but I would like to express my appreciation to MH for his thoughtful posts in this thread.

I would like to express my appreciation to MH for his thoughtful posts in this thread.
Originally Posted by jackfengshui

With this I do agree Jack with a few exceptions. Having never served in the military I have no basis to understand mh what it was like or what you went through but I do consider myself an informed citizen. I totally agree we know very few of the facts of the Embassy attacks but from what has been leaked we know a lot. The President said he would release any new information to the public when it was known. But he doesn’t answer questions about this. Nothing that has been reported has come from this administration except Hillary Clinton said she was responsible before she went to Peru.

What do we know………..We know there were several attacks on our embassy earlier in the year. We know other embassy and UN personnel were evacuated and left the country in July for safety reasons. We know our Ambassador was fearful for his and the staffs security and well-being because of leaked e-mails and his journal. We know the Libya police force was turned and did not have our back anymore. We know we were warned the day before September 11 that an attack was being planned. We know through testimony from Charlene Lamb that they were trying to normalize relations with Libya which meant no sign of force with added security. We don’t want to insult our friends. I agree mh that at times no amount of small security can survive a massive assault but we had drones, support an hour away and ex-navy seals a mile away who it was reported were told to stand down 3 times. When they couldn’t stand by hearing pleas for help any longer, they moved in to help. They saved quite a few of our people still there. The ambassador was put in a safe room and not killed until 5-7 hours after the attack started.

We know when an embassy is attacked hundreds of people and agencies are immediately notified so we could respond. Our people watched. You don’t think the President was informed of this attack right away? Of course he was. Remember the Hillary Clinton ad about the 3 am phone call? Well in this case our President put the call on hold and went to Vegas.

OSD,

Very well said thats the same feeling I have!!

OSD,

Very well said thats the same feeling I have!!
Originally Posted by vern0064

Ditto ditto ditto that. That picture and statement says it all. As an American I want our leaders to be truthful. Naive I know. But when a President says he wants everything to be transparent and will provide details as they become available, and then doesn't answer questions, what are we to expect. Just another politician covering his ass. If he was truthful he would tell the American people what his actions were and where he was during the 7 hour attack. He doesn't need to have an investigation to tell us that much. He was there..............

If he was truthful he would tell the American people what his actions were and where he was during the 7 hour attack. Originally Posted by montana1958

7 hours? I still like to know about his past in college/high school/etc. Why are all of his college papers sealed? I won't even go into the whole birther issue. Why is it that obama's past is all such a hush hush secret, but the media and all democrats are up in arms because Romney won't release more of his tax returns? He released everything required by law, but that isn't good enough. How about we see obama's birth certificate. Can we all say HUGE DOUBLE STANDARD?

And don't say he did release it. He should have released it before he was elected. Dishonesty at its worst. We know less about this current president than we do about any other president in history.

Yah, but he "CARES"

nothing else matters to a lib for some reason,

I cant figure it out because its the most hollow and the EASIEST thing a person can say.

Id rather this president stop "caring" so much and

just go away and

everyone else will just happily go on with their lives ..imo

7 hours? I still like to know about his past in college/high school/etc. Why are all of his college papers sealed? I won't even go into the whole birther issue. Why is it that obama's past is all such a hush hush secret, but the media and all democrats are up in arms because Romney won't release more of his tax returns? He released everything required by law, but that isn't good enough. How about we see obama's birth certificate. Can we all say HUGE DOUBLE STANDARD?

And don't say he did release it. He should have released it before he was elected. Dishonesty at its worst. We know less about this current president than we do about any other president in history. Originally Posted by GP

Go to your front door.

Open it.

Step outside.

Look up. Straight up.

What color do you see?

Go to your front door.

Open it.

Step outside.

Look up. Straight up.

What color do you see? Originally Posted by Doove

Pinck

Good luck to you Doove. It's been interesting trying to have a political discussion with you about Libya. The media was able to cover for Obama most of the damaging info that was leaked. CBS news actually announced today that in that 60 minutes interview, they edited the part out where Obama said Libya was not a terrorist attack, but rather was due to the you tube movie clip. If that had been reported he could not have used Candy Crowley in the second debate to protect his ass. It really is a shame what the media has done to not cover this story, and the way polls have been reported. I'm sure Doove you predict a win for Obama. I disagree. I plan on celebrating a big Romney Victory. And we will all live happily ever after.

I am not going to say I told you so after tomorrow.

“No one in this world has ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses of the plain people. Nor has anyone ever lost public office thereby.”

H.L.Mencken

“A professional politician is a professionally dishonourable man. In order to get anywhere near high office he has to make so many compromises and submit to so many humiliations that he becomes indistinguishable from a streetwalker.”


H.L.Mencken