Trump Caves On Tariifs w/China

I see it.. and I don't see Trump helping the cause for Hong Kong.

and still waiting on an explanation why Trump didn't cave.

let's be serious for once

I say Trump caved, but I'm open-minded about a different spin being applied. why did he grant 4 more months, and focus on electronics that US Consumers are faster to purchase? is it about the Hong Kong unrest? if so, explain. Originally Posted by Chung Tran

It's about politics. The tariffs would be imposed on items like Iphones, laptops, toys, shoes and apparel, and would cause consumers to pay more for those around Christmas time. This is maybe not the best political strategy coming into an election year. If you delay the implementation until December 15, Christmas sales won't be affected. A secondary consideration was Apple shareholders who are mad at Trump for running down their share price. Apple was going to get hit hard by this round of tariffs.

You may recall that tariffs on the first $250 billion or so of Chinese goods were imposed largely on products sold to U.S. businesses that were used as materials and parts for goods manufactured in the USA. That also was probably a political calculation. Small U.S. manufacturers dependent on Chinese imports add value in the USA and export part of their production, so that the consumers didn't notice as big of a price jump as they would this time around. Also perhaps the political fallout from bankrupting a few small U.S. manufacturers and hurting a lot more isn't perceived to be as bad as having hundreds of thousands of Apple shareholders mad at you.

As to Hong Kong, it's like Crimea and Russia. Trump's willing to let Hong Kong go down the tubes if it helps him get what he's seeking from China. Unfortunately, he probably doesn't recognize the seriousness of what could happen if the PLA came into the territory to restore order and decided to stay. Some believe this could result in a worldwide market meltdown, which would not be good for his re-election prospects.

I see it.. and I don't see Trump helping the cause for Hong Kong.

and still waiting on an explanation why Trump didn't cave. Originally Posted by Chung Tran

what can he do other than say what he has? that he prefers it does not escalate? he did in that video. holding off is not signing an agreement that gives China an advantage. this is yet to be determined. largely, Trump has done most of what he promised. re-done NAFTA. the EU would not agree to free trade. But for now there is no shift toward worse trade. Trump will take care of Britain, if they get their asses out of the EU. the "leftist/globalists" are fighting it tooth and nail.

they .. like liberals here .. want a re-vote. they aren't going to get it. Boris the spider is now in charge. He's the PM. He's pro BREXIT. He should just tell the EU a date and make it stick. fuck the EU. they may even try some obscure clause where they can reject ANY member withdraw.


EU Article 50. it's murky .. like any legalese is. the UK can invoke Article 50. Can the EU reject it? unclear.


A “no deal” Brexit does what it says on the tin. It means the UK and the EU has been unable to reach a withdrawal agreement. If this is the case, it means there will be no 21-month transition period. ... “[A no deal] doesn't stop the UK leaving but it means there is absolutely no clarity about what happens.”Jun 12, 2019


bottom line .. it appears the UK can exit without an agreement. what that means ... unclear. but they can do it.


https://inews.co.uk/news/brexit/no-d...-consequences/

As to Hong Kong, it's like Crimea and Russia. Trump's willing to let Hong Kong go down the tubes if it helps him get what he's seeking from China. Unfortunately, he probably doesn't recognize the seriousness of what could happen if the PLA came into the territory to restore order and decided to stay. Some believe this could result in a worldwide market meltdown, which would not be good for his re-election prospects. Originally Posted by Tiny

not really. Hong Kong IS a China territory by the British agreement in 1996. Crimea was part of Ukraine and Russia annexed it by force.

On Obama's watch.

interestingly ... Russia .. does have a longstanding claim to Ukraine dating back to the 1860's war with the Ottoman Empire. it was not until the fall of the USSR that Ukraine broke away. Crimea is a vital naval port for Russia. they didn't want to give it up. even if they have a shit-ass Navy with zero white water capability at present .. but it was future concerns than made Russia annex it.

guess what else was happening in world events at the same time Czarist Russia defeated the Ottomans for Ukraine?

The Civil War.

they .. like liberals here .. want a re-vote. they aren't going to get it. Boris the spider is now in charge. He's the PM. He's pro BREXIT. He should just tell the EU a date and make it stick. fuck the EU. they may even try some obscure clause where they can reject ANY member withdraw.


EU Article 50. it's murky .. like any legalese is. the UK can invoke Article 50. Can the EU reject it? unclear.


A “no deal” Brexit does what it says on the tin. It means the UK and the EU has been unable to reach a withdrawal agreement. If this is the case, it means there will be no 21-month transition period. ... “[A no deal] doesn't stop the UK leaving but it means there is absolutely no clarity about what happens.”Jun 12, 2019


bottom line .. it appears the UK can exit without an agreement. what that means ... unclear. but they can do it.


https://inews.co.uk/news/brexit/no-d...-consequences/ Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

There is one scenario under which Britain could leave the EU without an agreement and end up better off -- if they get rid of tariffs after they leave.

Repeating something I've already written, there was an article in the Economist, a British magazine, a couple of weeks ago, that looked at several studies of the economic effects of Brexit. Cases examined were as follows,

1. Britain leaves the EU, with no free trade agreement with the EU. And Britain then imposes tariffs allowed by World Trade Organization (WTO) rules on goods from other countries.

2. Britain leaves the EU, but with a free trade agreement with the EU.

3. Britain leaves the EU without an agreement and unilaterally reduces its tariffs on all imported goods to "0". This by the way is what Hong Kong and Singapore have done with great success.

"1" results in Britain being much worse off, with an economy that's 15% smaller than it would be otherwise some years in the future.

For "2", Britain ends up a little worse off than if they'd stayed in the EU.

For "3", Britain is better off than if it had never left the EU!

not really. Hong Kong IS a China territory by the British agreement in 1996. Crimea was part of Ukraine and Russia annexed it by force.

On Obama's watch.

interestingly ... Russia .. does have a longstanding claim to Ukraine dating back to the 1860's war with the Ottoman Empire. it was not until the fall of the USSR that Ukraine broke away. Crimea is a vital naval port for Russia. they didn't want to give it up. even if they have a shit-ass Navy with zero white water capability at present .. but it was future concerns than made Russia annex it.

guess what else was happening in world events at the same time Czarist Russia defeated the Ottomans for Ukraine?

The Civil War. Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

Again, good points. I didn't know that about the Ukraine. The Crimea situation is not clear cut. Trump correctly says that the majority of the people there would rather be part of Russia. People in Hong Kong on the other hand, as you know, do not want their territory to be just another city in China.

There is one scenario under which Britain could leave the EU without an agreement and end up better off -- if they get rid of tariffs after they leave.

Repeating something I've already written, there was an article in the Economist, a British magazine, a couple of weeks ago, that looked at several studies of the economic effects of Brexit. Cases examined were as follows,

1. Britain leaves the EU, with no free trade agreement with the EU. And Britain then imposes tariffs allowed by World Trade Organization (WTO) rules on goods from other countries.

2. Britain leaves the EU, but with a free trade agreement with the EU.

3. Britain leaves the EU without an agreement and unilaterally reduces its tariffs on all imported goods to "0". This by the way is what Hong Kong and Singapore have done with great success.

"1" results in Britain being much worse off, with an economy that's 15% smaller than it would be otherwise some years in the future.

For "2", Britain ends up a little worse off than if they'd stayed in the EU.

For "3", Britain is better off than if it had never left the EU! Originally Posted by Tiny

the article i posted a link to speaks to these possibilities.



Brexit… in brief


The single market is the free movement of movement of people, goods and services. A customs union is a bloc’s trade and tax agreement – normally free trade within members with fixed export duties with third parties


A soft Brexit would leave the UK closely aligned with the EU, with access to the single market and minimal impact on business. A hard Brexitwould take the UK completely out of all EU agreements.


A“no deal” Brexit does what it says on the tin. It means the UK and the EU would be unable to reach a agreement and there would be no transition period(or ‘implementation period’).
The notorious sticking point is the Irish ‘backstop’– the insurance plan for avoiding a hard border in Northern Ireland. One proposed solution has been a ‘Canada-style’ agreement which removes most EU restrictions but would not totally abolish the need for a hard border. Other suggestions have included the ‘Max fac’ plan which would use technology to electronically track goods crossing the border to prevent the need for border checks.


Got that? Okay, now here is what Mrs May’s Brexit deal contains and the next battle she faces is it being passed through Parliament and the row over what consists of a ‘meaningful vote’ which would give MP’s asay on the final deal.



Meanwhile she has to contend with Labour’s Jeremy Corbyn who is trying to push for his own ‘jobs-first Brexit’ deal AND MPs across all parties who have joined the campaign for a People’s Vote – or second Brexit referendum.
Simple…?

NOT!!!!! lol


yeah it's complicated. two things are certain, i'd think you will agree .. Boris "the Spider" Johnson is a staunch BREXITER and by design or fool's luck the UK looks like geniuses for not converting to the Euro. that might be their ace card.

yeah it's complicated. two things are certain, i'd think you will agree .. Boris "the Spider" Johnson is a staunch BREXITER and by design or fool's luck the UK looks like geniuses for not converting to the Euro. that might be their ace card.
Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

In addition to the problems extricating yourself from a common currency, if I were British I definitely wouldn't want my country participating in a currency union with Greece and Italy, or other profligate countries.

Boris Johnson can and has fucked up wet dreams. Brexit will require a miracle to complete, the Brits are that fucked up on this.

Johnson was one of the chief architects of this clusterfuck and barring Divine intervention or some really shifty shit, he’s got no time to make this happen. His head will roll the next time he farts in public.

At least that’s what I’m hearing from friends and family in the UK.

Leaving the EU may or may not be right for UK. That’s not the problem. The problem is that Johnson and May’s government didn’t have their shit together when they ran the issue and then proceeded to demonstrate just how badly things could get fucked up as a result.

I wonder how much help the US will pledge to help bail out for the impending disaster because you there’ll be others waiting to do so if we don’t.

Boris Johnson can and has fucked up wet dreams. Brexit will require a miracle to complete, the Brits are that fucked up on this.

Johnson was one of the chief architects of this clusterfuck and barring Divine intervention or some really shifty shit, he’s got no time to make this happen. His head will roll the next time he farts in public.

At least that’s what I’m hearing from friends and family in the UK.

Leaving the EU may or may not be right for UK. That’s not the problem. The problem is that Johnson and May’s government didn’t have their shit together when they ran the issue and then proceeded to demonstrate just how badly things could get fucked up as a result.

I wonder how much help the US will pledge to help bail out for the impending disaster because you there’ll be others waiting to do so if we don’t. Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

Johnson wasn't Prime Minister. May was. She couldn't get it passed in Parliament. Johnson and others bailed on her bullshit. It was like she was pro-EU rather than for the UK. that cunt paid with her job.

you think the UK should stay in the EU? What for? to get mass immigration shoved up their arses ? since you are clearly OPEN BORDERS .. that makes sense. from a libtard point of view. British trade has suffered under the EU not thrived. and there are other issues ....

and then there is this .. who was interfering with foreign elections??? Obama!

In addition to the problems extricating yourself from a common currency, if I were British I definitely wouldn't want my country participating in a currency union with Greece and Italy, or other profligate countries. Originally Posted by Tiny

how much of that was stiff upper lip by the Brits or just luck? or savvy financial foresight? all of the above?
i wonder what would have happened if the EU had said "go to the euro or we won't admit?"


maybe none of this would be happening now, yeah?

trump is feeling his way through the china thing to get to his goal-fairness and protection for intellectual property for America,. and is showing the Europeans what they should do as well.

unlike Clinton who gave the Chinese rocket engine technology in exchange for campaign contributions, trump is the only American leader who has put Chinese malfeasance on notice

hell diane feinstein had a Chinese spy as a driver for what ? 20 years?

trump has brought the Chinese issue to the fore

Obama was dissed by them and treated as a boy, having to exit air force one from the belly of the plane

"The reception that President Obama and his staff got when they arrived here Saturday afternoon was bruising, even by Chinese standards,” the New York Times reported.

no one knows what Obama or his minions did about that or what they tried to do

on the other hand, trump has developed a foundation for transparency that hopefully will have long lasting affect

From YR - Boris Johnson can and has fucked up wet dreams. Brexit will require a miracle to complete, the Brits are that fucked up on this.

Johnson was one of the chief architects of this clusterfuck and barring Divine intervention or some really shifty shit, he’s got no time to make this happen. His head will roll the next time he farts in public.



A very good political discussion was underway - then this profanity laced self-indulgent Socialist post appeared - totally out of context with the discussion.

Thanks for another thread hi-jack from the Axis of Socialism!
Got anything not straight from the Gutters and sewers of LA?



Ukraine separated fro the USSR because its' people wanted independence from Authoritarian russian rule.

Putin - under Obama's watch - took it back by force - and with the slightest bit of wiggle room - will do the same to the Baltic States, Poland, and other former Russian

Buffer' countries. Putin has made himself a neo-Tsar.

trump is feeling his way through the china thing to get to his goal-fairness and protection for intellectual property for America,. and is showing the Europeans what they should do as well. Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

That's not the way it's working out. China and Europe are doing more business together while we're left out in the cold.

on the other hand, trump has developed a foundation for transparency that hopefully will have long lasting affect Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

Is what he's doing transparent? When the rules change every three months it makes it hard for businesses to plan. The trade war is a threat to free markets.