It is why you are a bimbo, it is called flip flopping. Originally Posted by i'va biggenReally fucknuts? What politician doesn't "flip flop" goofball. It seems like Hillary is the biggest "flip flopper" here. She tried to win the 2008 nomination on it. She's just trying to overcome her "deplorable" statements. Hillary fucked up again. Hillarys people started the Birther movement. Nobody cares about this. Fuck her.
- bambino
- 09-16-2016, 07:12 PM
- i'va biggen
- 09-16-2016, 07:25 PM
Really fucknuts? What politician doesn't "flip flop" goofball. It seems like Hillary is the biggest "flip flopper" here. She tried to win the 2008 nomination on it. She's just trying to overcome her "deplorable" statements. Hillary fucked up again. Hillarys people started the Birther movement. Nobody cares about this. Fuck her. Originally Posted by bambinoIt is hard to hear you, with the lips glued to Trumps ass. You still can't produce a link where she used it in the campaign, you are sucking air.
- i'va biggen
- 09-16-2016, 07:28 PM
And once again, LittleLiberalEva, you jump to the defense of Hillary. The only reason you claim to support Gary Johnson is that it lets you say "Johnson" without others knowing what your talking about. We know, Eva, we know. Originally Posted by CuteOldGuyKicking you in the nuts is not defending Hillary. It is why you are whining again. Trump has swung far left now, makes you a democrat again. Hell you aren't even a first nations any more.
- Munchmasterman
- 09-16-2016, 08:27 PM
Donald Trump's Pants on Fire claim that he 'finished' the Obama birther talk
After years of promoting the theory that President Barack Obama was born in a foreign country -- one that has been consistentlydebunked by fact-checkers -- Donald Trump reversed course on Sept. 16, 2016, and said Obama was born in the United States.
"President Barack Obama was born in the United States. Period," Trump said while briefly addressing the subject at the end of a campaign event at his newly built hotel in Washington.
We’ve separately ruled this a Full Flop. But Trump’s other remarks on the so-called "birther" controversy have inspired fact-checks of their own.
Trump prefaced his statement about Obama’s birthplace by saying, "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy. I finished it. I finished it. You know what I mean."
We rated the first part of that claim that "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy" False.(Donald Trump repeated his debunked claim that Hillary Clinton started the rumors questioning whether President Barack Obama was born in the United States.
"Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy," Trump said in a 30-minute press conference Sept. 16, 2016. "I finished it."
The birther issue reemerged when the Washington Post asked Trump a day earlier if he believes Obama was born in the United States. He refused to answer.
"I’ll answer the question at the right time," Trump said Sept. 15. "I just don’t want to answer it yet."
This prompted a flurry of incredulity over his revitalization of the "birther" issue, which in turn prompted his campaign to answer the question for him and also accuse Clinton of starting it in the first place.
Trump has repeatedly claimed that Clinton began the whole issue in the first place. Trump said "Hillary is a birther" in February 2015 at CPAC, tweeted that "she was all in" in September 2015, and said "she brought it up years before it was brought up by me" on CNN in May 2016. The morning of his press conference, Trump brought it up again on Fox Business.
PolitiFact and our friends at FactCheck.org and the Washington Post Fact-Checker have debunkedthiszombie claimmultipletimes.
There is no evidence that Clinton or her 2008 campaign ever floated the theory. While Clinton supporters circulated the allegations the last time she ran for president, they had no ties to either the candidate or her staff.
A damning memo?
The Sept. 15 Trump campaign statement linked to a 2007 strategy memo published in the Atlantic from former Clinton aide Mark Penn that advises pointing out Obama’s "lack of American roots."
While Penn suggests Clinton "own ‘American’ in our programs," that’s not the same thing as suggesting Clinton question Obama’s citizenship or birthplace. The memo never advises that.
It also explicitly states, "We are never going to say anything about his background."
Furthermore, as the Atlantic and Politico reported in 2008, neither Clinton nor her campaign acted on Penn’s advice.
A not-damning chain email
The other piece of "evidence" linking Clinton to birtherism are emails circulated by supporters of Clinton during the last days of the 2008 Democratic primary after Clinton suspended her campaign.
According to a Telegraph article, Clinton supporters circulated the "birther" theory in an email as early as April 2008.
"Barack Obama’s mother was living in Kenya with his Arab-African father late in her pregnancy," the email said, according to the Telegraph. "She was not allowed to travel by plane then, so Barack Obama was born there and his mother then took him to Hawaii to register his birth."
The allegations gained momentum that month. Clinton conceded the race on June 7, and three days later a website called Pumaparty.com (an acroynom for Party Unity My A--) encouraged Clinton backers to support Republican nominee Sen. John McCain.
The website promoted the theory with an email that read, "Obama May Be Illegal to Be Elected President," as Daily Beast editor John Avlon has documented.
According to Avlon, Linda Starr, a Clinton volunteer in Texas, was key to spreading the rumor. She connected with with Philip Berger, an attorney and Clinton supporter, who sued to block Obama’s nomination. The suit was thrown out.
But this is not the same thing as Clinton or her campaign promoting the theory. There is no evidence that they ever have done so. Clinton has dismissed the allegation when Trump made his accusation last September in an interview with CNN’s Don Lemon.
"That is — no. That is so ludicrous, Don. You know, honestly, I just believe that, first of all, it’s totally untrue, and secondly, you know, the president and I have never had any kind of confrontation like that," Clinton said. "You know, I have been blamed for nearly everything, that was a new one to me."
(Another thing to note: Clinton volunteers forwarded emails promoting the myth that Obama is a Muslim. As we have previously reported, both resigned from the campaign after they were found to have spread the rumor. The Clinton campaign condemned their actions and said it was unauthorized.)
Our ruling
Trump said, "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy."
There is no evidence to support this. Clinton supporters circulated the rumor in the last days of the 2008 Democratic primary and after Clinton had concede to Obama. But the record does not show Clinton or her campaign ever promoting the birther theory, let alone starting it.
We rate Trump’s claim False.)
Here, we’ll fact-check the assertion that Trump "finished it."
We didn’t hear back from the Trump campaign, but the evening before Trump’s announcement in Washington, Jason Miller, a senior communications adviser with the campaign, sent out a news release saying in part, "In 2011, Mr. Trump was finally able to bring this ugly incident to its conclusion by successfully compelling President Obama to release his birth certificate. Mr. Trump did a great service to the President and the country by bringing closure to the issue that Hillary Clinton and her team first raised."
So it appears that the campaign’s argument is that Trump pushed for Obama to release the long form of his Hawaii birth certificate onApril 27, 2011, several years after the birther controversy bubbled up. Previously, a shorter version of the document had been available, but skeptics had been calling for the full document to be released.
Trump himself had made this case as early as Aug. 22, 2013, when hetweeted, "Why are people upset w/ me over Pres Obama’s birth certificate? I got him to release it, or whatever it was, when nobody else could!"
But for Trump’s argument to hold water, we see two conditions that have to be met. First, did Trump "finish" advocating for the birther viewpoint once Obama released the long-form birth certificate? And second, did Obama’s release of the long-form certificate "finish" the idea among American voters that Obama was born outside the United States?
In both cases, the answer is no.
Trump’s continued birther tweets
Slate has produced a comprehensive index to the tweets by Trump -- all made after Obama’s document release in 2011 -- in which the real-estate magnate either openly advocated birtherism or promoted skepticism about the official story of Obama’s birth.
The list includes about three dozen examples between November 2011 and November 2014. Here’s a sampling:
July 17, 2012: "I wonder what the answer is on @BarackObama's college application to the question: place of birth? Maybe the same as his book cover? Release your records, Mr. President!"
July 20, 2012: "With @BarackObama listing himself as "Born in Kenya" in 1999 http://bit.ly/JaHQW0 HI laws allowed him to produce a fake certificate. #SCAM"
Aug. 6, 2012: "An 'extremely credible source' has called my office and told me that @BarackObama's birth certificate is a fraud."
Aug. 27, 2012: "Why do the Republicans keep apologizing on the so called "birther" issue? No more apologies--take the offensive!"
Sept. 13, 2012: "Wake Up America! See article: "Israeli Science: Obama Birth Certificate is a Fake" http://bit.ly/UIfG7B."
June 29, 2014: "Always remember, I was the one who got Obama to release his birth certificate, or whatever that was! Hilary couldn't, McCain couldn't."
Sept. 6, 2014: "Attention all hackers: You are hacking everything else so please hack Obama's college records (destroyed?) and check ‘place of birth’
Public opinion about Obama’s birthplace
The birther controversy never actually ended, either, judging by the polls.
For starters, the birth certificate release itself didn't eliminate skepticism within the public about Obama’s birthplace -- not even close.
At least two surveys looked at the question shortly before and shortly after Obama’s document release. Gallup asked whether respondents would say Obama was "probably or definitely born in another country" and found that the number dropped from 24 percent before the release in April 2011 to 13 percent after the release in May 2011. And YouGov asked whether "Barack Obama was born in the United States." Before the release, 15 percent of respondent said "false," a number that dropped to 13 percent after the release.
Thirteen percent is not a trivial number of people in a nation of more than 300 million people.
As time went on, polls by YouGov actually found rising numbers of respondents answering "false" "Barack Obama was born in the United States" -- 17 percent in January 2012 and 20 percent in July 2012.
And as recently as September 2015, a CNN/Opinion Research Corp.poll found 13 percent answering "another country" when asked, "Where was Barack Obama born, as far as you know?" That poll was taken more than four years after Obama released his long-form birth certificate.
Our ruling
Trump said of the birther controversy, "I finished it."
In no credible sense is this true. Trump didn’t "finish" fanning the flames of birther conspiracies once Obama released his long-form birth certificate in April 2011 -- he kept tweeting about it for at least another three and a half years. And a core group of Americans hasn’t "finished" expressing birther sentiments. As recently as a year ago, various polls have found that 13 percent of Americans supported the viewpoint.
We rate Trump’s claim Pants on Fire
Those same chumps think this is over. Hope he's ready for it at the debate.
Do you have those little index tabs on your fat rolls? So you can find which fat rolls hide your "dick"? Where your balls used to be? Where you keep that spare chicken salad sandwich?
Or most important, where your pussy is at.
Or do you just piss and squeegee yourself off later?
After years of promoting the theory that President Barack Obama was born in a foreign country -- one that has been consistentlydebunked by fact-checkers -- Donald Trump reversed course on Sept. 16, 2016, and said Obama was born in the United States.
"President Barack Obama was born in the United States. Period," Trump said while briefly addressing the subject at the end of a campaign event at his newly built hotel in Washington.
We’ve separately ruled this a Full Flop. But Trump’s other remarks on the so-called "birther" controversy have inspired fact-checks of their own.
Trump prefaced his statement about Obama’s birthplace by saying, "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy. I finished it. I finished it. You know what I mean."
We rated the first part of that claim that "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy" False.(Donald Trump repeated his debunked claim that Hillary Clinton started the rumors questioning whether President Barack Obama was born in the United States.
"Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy," Trump said in a 30-minute press conference Sept. 16, 2016. "I finished it."
The birther issue reemerged when the Washington Post asked Trump a day earlier if he believes Obama was born in the United States. He refused to answer.
"I’ll answer the question at the right time," Trump said Sept. 15. "I just don’t want to answer it yet."
This prompted a flurry of incredulity over his revitalization of the "birther" issue, which in turn prompted his campaign to answer the question for him and also accuse Clinton of starting it in the first place.
Trump has repeatedly claimed that Clinton began the whole issue in the first place. Trump said "Hillary is a birther" in February 2015 at CPAC, tweeted that "she was all in" in September 2015, and said "she brought it up years before it was brought up by me" on CNN in May 2016. The morning of his press conference, Trump brought it up again on Fox Business.
PolitiFact and our friends at FactCheck.org and the Washington Post Fact-Checker have debunkedthiszombie claimmultipletimes.
There is no evidence that Clinton or her 2008 campaign ever floated the theory. While Clinton supporters circulated the allegations the last time she ran for president, they had no ties to either the candidate or her staff.
A damning memo?
The Sept. 15 Trump campaign statement linked to a 2007 strategy memo published in the Atlantic from former Clinton aide Mark Penn that advises pointing out Obama’s "lack of American roots."
While Penn suggests Clinton "own ‘American’ in our programs," that’s not the same thing as suggesting Clinton question Obama’s citizenship or birthplace. The memo never advises that.
It also explicitly states, "We are never going to say anything about his background."
Furthermore, as the Atlantic and Politico reported in 2008, neither Clinton nor her campaign acted on Penn’s advice.
A not-damning chain email
The other piece of "evidence" linking Clinton to birtherism are emails circulated by supporters of Clinton during the last days of the 2008 Democratic primary after Clinton suspended her campaign.
According to a Telegraph article, Clinton supporters circulated the "birther" theory in an email as early as April 2008.
"Barack Obama’s mother was living in Kenya with his Arab-African father late in her pregnancy," the email said, according to the Telegraph. "She was not allowed to travel by plane then, so Barack Obama was born there and his mother then took him to Hawaii to register his birth."
The allegations gained momentum that month. Clinton conceded the race on June 7, and three days later a website called Pumaparty.com (an acroynom for Party Unity My A--) encouraged Clinton backers to support Republican nominee Sen. John McCain.
The website promoted the theory with an email that read, "Obama May Be Illegal to Be Elected President," as Daily Beast editor John Avlon has documented.
According to Avlon, Linda Starr, a Clinton volunteer in Texas, was key to spreading the rumor. She connected with with Philip Berger, an attorney and Clinton supporter, who sued to block Obama’s nomination. The suit was thrown out.
But this is not the same thing as Clinton or her campaign promoting the theory. There is no evidence that they ever have done so. Clinton has dismissed the allegation when Trump made his accusation last September in an interview with CNN’s Don Lemon.
"That is — no. That is so ludicrous, Don. You know, honestly, I just believe that, first of all, it’s totally untrue, and secondly, you know, the president and I have never had any kind of confrontation like that," Clinton said. "You know, I have been blamed for nearly everything, that was a new one to me."
(Another thing to note: Clinton volunteers forwarded emails promoting the myth that Obama is a Muslim. As we have previously reported, both resigned from the campaign after they were found to have spread the rumor. The Clinton campaign condemned their actions and said it was unauthorized.)
Our ruling
Trump said, "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy."
There is no evidence to support this. Clinton supporters circulated the rumor in the last days of the 2008 Democratic primary and after Clinton had concede to Obama. But the record does not show Clinton or her campaign ever promoting the birther theory, let alone starting it.
We rate Trump’s claim False.)
Here, we’ll fact-check the assertion that Trump "finished it."
We didn’t hear back from the Trump campaign, but the evening before Trump’s announcement in Washington, Jason Miller, a senior communications adviser with the campaign, sent out a news release saying in part, "In 2011, Mr. Trump was finally able to bring this ugly incident to its conclusion by successfully compelling President Obama to release his birth certificate. Mr. Trump did a great service to the President and the country by bringing closure to the issue that Hillary Clinton and her team first raised."
So it appears that the campaign’s argument is that Trump pushed for Obama to release the long form of his Hawaii birth certificate onApril 27, 2011, several years after the birther controversy bubbled up. Previously, a shorter version of the document had been available, but skeptics had been calling for the full document to be released.
Trump himself had made this case as early as Aug. 22, 2013, when hetweeted, "Why are people upset w/ me over Pres Obama’s birth certificate? I got him to release it, or whatever it was, when nobody else could!"
But for Trump’s argument to hold water, we see two conditions that have to be met. First, did Trump "finish" advocating for the birther viewpoint once Obama released the long-form birth certificate? And second, did Obama’s release of the long-form certificate "finish" the idea among American voters that Obama was born outside the United States?
In both cases, the answer is no.
Trump’s continued birther tweets
Slate has produced a comprehensive index to the tweets by Trump -- all made after Obama’s document release in 2011 -- in which the real-estate magnate either openly advocated birtherism or promoted skepticism about the official story of Obama’s birth.
The list includes about three dozen examples between November 2011 and November 2014. Here’s a sampling:
July 17, 2012: "I wonder what the answer is on @BarackObama's college application to the question: place of birth? Maybe the same as his book cover? Release your records, Mr. President!"
July 20, 2012: "With @BarackObama listing himself as "Born in Kenya" in 1999 http://bit.ly/JaHQW0 HI laws allowed him to produce a fake certificate. #SCAM"
Aug. 6, 2012: "An 'extremely credible source' has called my office and told me that @BarackObama's birth certificate is a fraud."
Aug. 27, 2012: "Why do the Republicans keep apologizing on the so called "birther" issue? No more apologies--take the offensive!"
Sept. 13, 2012: "Wake Up America! See article: "Israeli Science: Obama Birth Certificate is a Fake" http://bit.ly/UIfG7B."
June 29, 2014: "Always remember, I was the one who got Obama to release his birth certificate, or whatever that was! Hilary couldn't, McCain couldn't."
Sept. 6, 2014: "Attention all hackers: You are hacking everything else so please hack Obama's college records (destroyed?) and check ‘place of birth’
Public opinion about Obama’s birthplace
The birther controversy never actually ended, either, judging by the polls.
For starters, the birth certificate release itself didn't eliminate skepticism within the public about Obama’s birthplace -- not even close.
At least two surveys looked at the question shortly before and shortly after Obama’s document release. Gallup asked whether respondents would say Obama was "probably or definitely born in another country" and found that the number dropped from 24 percent before the release in April 2011 to 13 percent after the release in May 2011. And YouGov asked whether "Barack Obama was born in the United States." Before the release, 15 percent of respondent said "false," a number that dropped to 13 percent after the release.
Thirteen percent is not a trivial number of people in a nation of more than 300 million people.
As time went on, polls by YouGov actually found rising numbers of respondents answering "false" "Barack Obama was born in the United States" -- 17 percent in January 2012 and 20 percent in July 2012.
And as recently as September 2015, a CNN/Opinion Research Corp.poll found 13 percent answering "another country" when asked, "Where was Barack Obama born, as far as you know?" That poll was taken more than four years after Obama released his long-form birth certificate.
Our ruling
Trump said of the birther controversy, "I finished it."
In no credible sense is this true. Trump didn’t "finish" fanning the flames of birther conspiracies once Obama released his long-form birth certificate in April 2011 -- he kept tweeting about it for at least another three and a half years. And a core group of Americans hasn’t "finished" expressing birther sentiments. As recently as a year ago, various polls have found that 13 percent of Americans supported the viewpoint.
We rate Trump’s claim Pants on Fire
Nobody is more dishonest than Hillary, AssupHack. Why doesn't that bother you? Originally Posted by CuteOldGuyThis is just your opinion. I can produce data (from politifact which includes Benghazi nontruths and email nontruths) which shows trump lies at @ a 70% rate compared to Clinton's less than 30%ish
Trump is too smart for the very people who think he is dumb. Perhaps they will reconsider their position at some point.The only people who don't see him as making dumb shit mistake after mistake and telling easily proven lies are his poorly educated base and his non-reconsidering peons.
Plus, they probably have ugly wives and are jealous. Originally Posted by DSK
He calls a presser presumably about the Birther issue. Every network covers the event. It's at his new hotel, with many highly decorated veterans. They all promote Trump. At the end, Trump says Obama was born in America. Now let's get back to making America great again. Trump again gets free airtime. Obama later agreed that there was more important things to discuss. Trump punks the media and Hillary. Brilliant.I can see how a chump would think pure bluster "punks" the media
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bmyFsnzleX8 Originally Posted by bambino
So what Smalls, Clintons cronies started the thing to begin with. Why do you think Obama told Clinton Blumenthal couldn't get near the State Dept. Blumenthal was the one to originate the Birther thing amongst other attacks on Obama. The point is, Trump played the media masterfully.I can see how a chump would think that too. You can see why he doesn't want the moderators to fact-check any statements made or why he doesn't want moderators at all.
http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/20...-media-silent/
Trump schlonged them too! Originally Posted by bambino
Those same chumps think this is over. Hope he's ready for it at the debate.
Do you have those little index tabs on your fat rolls? So you can find which fat rolls hide your "dick"? Where your balls used to be? Where you keep that spare chicken salad sandwich?
Or most important, where your pussy is at.
Or do you just piss and squeegee yourself off later?
- I B Hankering
- 09-16-2016, 08:46 PM
blah, blah, fuckin' blah. Originally Posted by MunchmastermanA 2008 hildebeest campaign volunteer admitted she started the rumor with an email, masterdickmuncher. It's a lie to claim that a hildebeest campaign worker that was tracked down as the source and who admitted to be the source who started the birther movement didn't work for hildebeest's campaign, masterdickmuncher, when it's obvious she did.
The 'Birthers' Began on the Left
“[T]here's an inconvenient truth liberals are going to have to confront: The Birthers began not on the right, but on the left.
“Investigations for my new book … revealed that the Birther conspiracy theory was first concocted by renegade members of the original Odumbo haters, Party Unity My Ass, known more commonly by their acronym, the PUMAs. They were a splinter group of hard-core hildebeest supporters who did not want to give up the ghost after the bitter 50-state Bataan Death March to the 2008 dum-retard nomination.”
(The Daily Beast)
“Linda Starr, a hilbebeest volunteer in Texas, played a key role in spreading the rumor. Starr connected with Pennsylvania attorney Philip Berg in August and Berg followed up by suing in federal court to block Obama’s nomination.”
(Politifact)
- DSK
- 09-16-2016, 09:26 PM
- Yssup Rider
- 09-16-2016, 10:39 PM
What horseshit.
I guess Drumpf is exempt from reality.
Ironic.
He'll be backing out of second and third debates.
I guess Drumpf is exempt from reality.
Ironic.
He'll be backing out of second and third debates.
- DSK
- 09-17-2016, 08:23 AM
- bambino
- 09-17-2016, 08:39 AM
Donald Trump's Pants on Fire claim that he 'finished' the Obama birther talkWhat a complete waste of space Assmuncher. The Puma Party and Syd Blumenthal started the Birther deal, not Trump. And it's not an issue today. It's a waste of time discussing it as Obama said yesterday you fuckwad. And you faggot, I'd bet I'm in much better shape than you. It's obvious you have your head buried deep inside Asswipes ass. Munch away fag boy.
After years of promoting the theory that President Barack Obama was born in a foreign country -- one that has been consistentlydebunked by fact-checkers -- Donald Trump reversed course on Sept. 16, 2016, and said Obama was born in the United States.
"President Barack Obama was born in the United States. Period," Trump said while briefly addressing the subject at the end of a campaign event at his newly built hotel in Washington.
We’ve separately ruled this a Full Flop. But Trump’s other remarks on the so-called "birther" controversy have inspired fact-checks of their own.
Trump prefaced his statement about Obama’s birthplace by saying, "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy. I finished it. I finished it. You know what I mean."
We rated the first part of that claim that "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy" False.(Donald Trump repeated his debunked claim that Hillary Clinton started the rumors questioning whether President Barack Obama was born in the United States.
"Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy," Trump said in a 30-minute press conference Sept. 16, 2016. "I finished it."
The birther issue reemerged when the Washington Post asked Trump a day earlier if he believes Obama was born in the United States. He refused to answer.
"I’ll answer the question at the right time," Trump said Sept. 15. "I just don’t want to answer it yet."
This prompted a flurry of incredulity over his revitalization of the "birther" issue, which in turn prompted his campaign to answer the question for him and also accuse Clinton of starting it in the first place.
Trump has repeatedly claimed that Clinton began the whole issue in the first place. Trump said "Hillary is a birther" in February 2015 at CPAC, tweeted that "she was all in" in September 2015, and said "she brought it up years before it was brought up by me" on CNN in May 2016. The morning of his press conference, Trump brought it up again on Fox Business.
PolitiFact and our friends at FactCheck.org and the Washington Post Fact-Checker have debunkedthiszombie claimmultipletimes.
There is no evidence that Clinton or her 2008 campaign ever floated the theory. While Clinton supporters circulated the allegations the last time she ran for president, they had no ties to either the candidate or her staff.
A damning memo?
The Sept. 15 Trump campaign statement linked to a 2007 strategy memo published in the Atlantic from former Clinton aide Mark Penn that advises pointing out Obama’s "lack of American roots."
While Penn suggests Clinton "own ‘American’ in our programs," that’s not the same thing as suggesting Clinton question Obama’s citizenship or birthplace. The memo never advises that.
It also explicitly states, "We are never going to say anything about his background."
Furthermore, as the Atlantic and Politico reported in 2008, neither Clinton nor her campaign acted on Penn’s advice.
A not-damning chain email
The other piece of "evidence" linking Clinton to birtherism are emails circulated by supporters of Clinton during the last days of the 2008 Democratic primary after Clinton suspended her campaign.
According to a Telegraph article, Clinton supporters circulated the "birther" theory in an email as early as April 2008.
"Barack Obama’s mother was living in Kenya with his Arab-African father late in her pregnancy," the email said, according to the Telegraph. "She was not allowed to travel by plane then, so Barack Obama was born there and his mother then took him to Hawaii to register his birth."
The allegations gained momentum that month. Clinton conceded the race on June 7, and three days later a website called Pumaparty.com (an acroynom for Party Unity My A--) encouraged Clinton backers to support Republican nominee Sen. John McCain.
The website promoted the theory with an email that read, "Obama May Be Illegal to Be Elected President," as Daily Beast editor John Avlon has documented.
According to Avlon, Linda Starr, a Clinton volunteer in Texas, was key to spreading the rumor. She connected with with Philip Berger, an attorney and Clinton supporter, who sued to block Obama’s nomination. The suit was thrown out.
But this is not the same thing as Clinton or her campaign promoting the theory. There is no evidence that they ever have done so. Clinton has dismissed the allegation when Trump made his accusation last September in an interview with CNN’s Don Lemon.
"That is — no. That is so ludicrous, Don. You know, honestly, I just believe that, first of all, it’s totally untrue, and secondly, you know, the president and I have never had any kind of confrontation like that," Clinton said. "You know, I have been blamed for nearly everything, that was a new one to me."
(Another thing to note: Clinton volunteers forwarded emails promoting the myth that Obama is a Muslim. As we have previously reported, both resigned from the campaign after they were found to have spread the rumor. The Clinton campaign condemned their actions and said it was unauthorized.)
Our ruling
Trump said, "Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy."
There is no evidence to support this. Clinton supporters circulated the rumor in the last days of the 2008 Democratic primary and after Clinton had concede to Obama. But the record does not show Clinton or her campaign ever promoting the birther theory, let alone starting it.
We rate Trump’s claim False.)
Here, we’ll fact-check the assertion that Trump "finished it."
We didn’t hear back from the Trump campaign, but the evening before Trump’s announcement in Washington, Jason Miller, a senior communications adviser with the campaign, sent out a news release saying in part, "In 2011, Mr. Trump was finally able to bring this ugly incident to its conclusion by successfully compelling President Obama to release his birth certificate. Mr. Trump did a great service to the President and the country by bringing closure to the issue that Hillary Clinton and her team first raised."
So it appears that the campaign’s argument is that Trump pushed for Obama to release the long form of his Hawaii birth certificate onApril 27, 2011, several years after the birther controversy bubbled up. Previously, a shorter version of the document had been available, but skeptics had been calling for the full document to be released.
Trump himself had made this case as early as Aug. 22, 2013, when hetweeted, "Why are people upset w/ me over Pres Obama’s birth certificate? I got him to release it, or whatever it was, when nobody else could!"
But for Trump’s argument to hold water, we see two conditions that have to be met. First, did Trump "finish" advocating for the birther viewpoint once Obama released the long-form birth certificate? And second, did Obama’s release of the long-form certificate "finish" the idea among American voters that Obama was born outside the United States?
In both cases, the answer is no.
Trump’s continued birther tweets
Slate has produced a comprehensive index to the tweets by Trump -- all made after Obama’s document release in 2011 -- in which the real-estate magnate either openly advocated birtherism or promoted skepticism about the official story of Obama’s birth.
The list includes about three dozen examples between November 2011 and November 2014. Here’s a sampling:
July 17, 2012: "I wonder what the answer is on @BarackObama's college application to the question: place of birth? Maybe the same as his book cover? Release your records, Mr. President!"
July 20, 2012: "With @BarackObama listing himself as "Born in Kenya" in 1999 http://bit.ly/JaHQW0 HI laws allowed him to produce a fake certificate. #SCAM"
Aug. 6, 2012: "An 'extremely credible source' has called my office and told me that @BarackObama's birth certificate is a fraud."
Aug. 27, 2012: "Why do the Republicans keep apologizing on the so called "birther" issue? No more apologies--take the offensive!"
Sept. 13, 2012: "Wake Up America! See article: "Israeli Science: Obama Birth Certificate is a Fake" http://bit.ly/UIfG7B."
June 29, 2014: "Always remember, I was the one who got Obama to release his birth certificate, or whatever that was! Hilary couldn't, McCain couldn't."
Sept. 6, 2014: "Attention all hackers: You are hacking everything else so please hack Obama's college records (destroyed?) and check ‘place of birth’
Public opinion about Obama’s birthplace
The birther controversy never actually ended, either, judging by the polls.
For starters, the birth certificate release itself didn't eliminate skepticism within the public about Obama’s birthplace -- not even close.
At least two surveys looked at the question shortly before and shortly after Obama’s document release. Gallup asked whether respondents would say Obama was "probably or definitely born in another country" and found that the number dropped from 24 percent before the release in April 2011 to 13 percent after the release in May 2011. And YouGov asked whether "Barack Obama was born in the United States." Before the release, 15 percent of respondent said "false," a number that dropped to 13 percent after the release.
Thirteen percent is not a trivial number of people in a nation of more than 300 million people.
As time went on, polls by YouGov actually found rising numbers of respondents answering "false" "Barack Obama was born in the United States" -- 17 percent in January 2012 and 20 percent in July 2012.
And as recently as September 2015, a CNN/Opinion Research Corp.poll found 13 percent answering "another country" when asked, "Where was Barack Obama born, as far as you know?" That poll was taken more than four years after Obama released his long-form birth certificate.
Our ruling
Trump said of the birther controversy, "I finished it."
In no credible sense is this true. Trump didn’t "finish" fanning the flames of birther conspiracies once Obama released his long-form birth certificate in April 2011 -- he kept tweeting about it for at least another three and a half years. And a core group of Americans hasn’t "finished" expressing birther sentiments. As recently as a year ago, various polls have found that 13 percent of Americans supported the viewpoint.
We rate Trump’s claim Pants on Fire
This is just your opinion. I can produce data (from politifact which includes Benghazi nontruths and email nontruths) which shows trump lies at @ a 70% rate compared to Clinton's less than 30%ish
The only people who don't see him as making dumb shit mistake after mistake and telling easily proven lies are his poorly educated base and his non-reconsidering peons.
I can see how a chump would think pure bluster "punks" the media
I can see how a chump would think that too. You can see why he doesn't want the moderators to fact-check any statements made or why he doesn't want moderators at all.
Those same chumps think this is over. Hope he's ready for it at the debate.
Do you have those little index tabs on your fat rolls? So you can find which fat rolls hide your "dick"? Where your balls used to be? Where you keep that spare chicken salad sandwich?
Or most important, where your pussy is at.
Or do you just piss and squeegee yourself off later? Originally Posted by Munchmasterman
- Yssup Rider
- 09-17-2016, 08:46 AM
- Sistine Chapel
- 09-17-2016, 09:10 AM
He calls a presser presumably about the Birther issue. Every network covers the event. It's at his new hotel, with many highly decorated veterans. They all promote Trump. At the end, Trump says Obama was born in America. Now let's get back to making America great again. Trump again gets free airtime. Obama later agreed that there was more important things to discuss. Trump punks the media and Hillary. Brilliant.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bmyFsnzleX8 Originally Posted by bambino
Haha. You folks just don't think outside of the box. You do realize it's never a winning strategy to fuck with the media like this since they have the mega watt power to sway votes. Trump and his campaign are just not smart. The media will make them pay when he wants and needs them to get out a certain message the most; during the most critical time they will completely fuck him. He just silently cost himself the election with this move.
Again I'm encouraging you folks to think outside the box; step back and take a look at the bigger picture. Laugh now but you will be crying later. Yall just continue to not get it.
- bambino
- 09-17-2016, 09:27 AM
Haha. You folks just don't think outside of the box. You do realize it's never a winning strategy to fuck with the media like this since they have the mega watt power to sway votes. Trump and his campaign are just not smart. The media will make them pay when he wants and needs them to get out a certain message the most; during the most critical time they will completely fuck him. He just silently cost himself the election with this move.The Trump campaign isn't smart? They've got billions in free airtime! More than any campaign in history. Hillary has spent hundreds of millions and is losing ground to Trump. The more you post the dumber you get. You antisemitic, bigoted, bevel headed sap sucker.
Again I'm encouraging you folks to think outside the box; step back and take a look at the bigger picture. Laugh now but you will be crying later. Yall just continue to not get it. Originally Posted by Sistine Chapel
- Sistine Chapel
- 09-17-2016, 09:38 AM
The Trump campaign isn't smart? They've got billions in free airtime! More than any campaign in history. Hillary has spent hundreds of millions and is losing ground to Trump. The more you post the dumber you get. You antisemitic, bigoted, bevel headed sap sucker. Originally Posted by bambino
No they're not smart. Not by a long shot. Again you're convoluting Trump's reality TV ability and buffonish style character with his campaign's ability to get his message out. Trust me or not and I don't say this often but you Bimbo; you are not on my higher thinking level in anyway. I'm almost to the point of openly saying you're beneath me but it's not a Christian thing to say so I will refrain. Instead we can have a beer summit one day.
- Yssup Rider
- 09-17-2016, 09:44 AM
Billions?
This is another reason why he's Bambully the Ibored.
He has no grasp on reality. Doesn't know what media advertising costs. Doesn't understand how it works.
And now he's cheering that Drumpf "punked" the media. He actually swallows the demagoguery that Drumpf shits out day in and day out begs for more.
Yeah, Drumpf sure showed 'em. Tied up the air for 30 minutes while he jerked off in his new hotel and then said "Period." Mike drop.
He punked Bambully the Ignored and the rest of his followers, but revealing his arrogance and disingenuousness yet again.
Deplorable.
This is another reason why he's Bambully the Ibored.
He has no grasp on reality. Doesn't know what media advertising costs. Doesn't understand how it works.
And now he's cheering that Drumpf "punked" the media. He actually swallows the demagoguery that Drumpf shits out day in and day out begs for more.
Yeah, Drumpf sure showed 'em. Tied up the air for 30 minutes while he jerked off in his new hotel and then said "Period." Mike drop.
He punked Bambully the Ignored and the rest of his followers, but revealing his arrogance and disingenuousness yet again.
Deplorable.
- LexusLover
- 09-17-2016, 09:57 AM
YouRong..
... runs through the forum
... screaming .... LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME!!
(Got nothing to say, but he just posts shit comments!)
... runs through the forum
... screaming .... LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME!!
(Got nothing to say, but he just posts shit comments!)