Obamacare Death Panels Arriving

Duh! Originally Posted by LexusLover

very mature of you. kudos

One little thing; when you get "cadillac" healthcare benefits then you have to pay a fine for having too much healthcare available (from each according to his means to each according to his needs) Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

If you would STFU and read more teach, you might quit commenting on things you know nothing about.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/05/ny...anted=all&_r=0

Jonathan Gruber, an economist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology who was a paid consultant to the Obama administration on health care policy, said forcing state and local governments to rein in health care costs was exactly what the tax was intended to do.

Jonathan Gruber, an economist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology who was a paid consultant to the Obama administration on health care policy, said forcing state and local governments to rein in health care costs was exactly what the tax was intended to do. Originally Posted by WTF

That's some funny shit right there.

That's some funny shit right there. Originally Posted by LexusLover

Yea pointing out you right wing loons lies is always kinda funny. Though it is getting old.

So you want us to believe that what you said was the absolute truth? Oh, right. You didn't say anything. You posted a link. Are you willing to live and die by that link? What happens when I post another link saying the opposite? Do we have a fight between "experts"?

I wonder if you even read your link? I know that you didn't or you can't comphrehend again. What the link says is that the "cadillac" tax is real. If you have a great plan then you pay a tax for the privilege. The article also says that the union leadership is trying to get workers to accept crappier plans to get under the cap. How about that. The bosses want their slaves, errr, union workers to give up their good plans for not so good plans. Classy...

Your Jonathon Gruber (why you posted what he thinks is problematic) is a advisor to Clinton, Edwards, and Obama. So his credibility is suspect at the very least. Unless you want to show me what he really wrote.

Don't get off the porch. The big dogs are running.

So you want us to believe that what you said was the absolute truth? Oh, right. You didn't say anything. You posted a link. Are you willing to live and die by that link? What happens when I post another link saying the opposite? Do we have a fight between "experts"? Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

I posted wtf the paid expert said his intentions were when they put that tax on. You understand they exempted other unions. So wtf he said about that subject matter just may be true. Now post your link that says the opposite or are you just bullshitting? Do you need to ask for another chain e-mail from your dip shit Tea Party cohorts?

post a link and its no good

don't post a link and the wingers demand one


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Well we seem to be at odds about what we're talking about. I, and so many others here, are talking about the result and you seem to be talking about intentions. I can post a link (I thought I already did) that is about the results; death panels (I like that name) are real and though he won't use the name democratic candidate Howard Dean agrees. Sarah Palin, this probably reals burns your ass, has been verified as a truth teller. Now do you want to talk about intentions or reality. Remember what the road to hell is paved with. Just because you are a utilitarian doesn't mean that you can ignore the results.

Here it is from a different source http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/...lth-care-rati/

Former Vermont governor and Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean has had plenty of good things to say about Obamacare, but he does not believe an independent board that can determine health-care cost rates and services — dubbed a “death panel” by its most vociferous detractors — will work as intended.
The Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB) — “essentially a health-care rationing body,” Mr. Dean writes — has “no possibility” of working to curb health care costs and “will almost certainly make the system more bureaucratic and therefore drive up administrative costs.”
“By setting doctor reimbursement rates for Medicare and determining which procedures and drugs will be covered and at what price, the IPAB will be able to stop certain treatments its members do not favor by simply setting rates to levels where no doctor or hospital will perform them,” Mr. Dean writes in a piece in the Wall Street Journal.
There does have to be control of costs in our health-care system, Mr. Dean writes, but rate setting “has a 40-year track record of failure.”
“What ends up happening in these schemes (which many states including my home state of Vermont have implemented with virtually no long-term effect on costs) is that patients and physicians get aggravated because bureaucrats in either the private or public sector are making medical decisions without knowing the patients,” he writes. “Most important, once again, these kinds of schemes do not control costs. The medical system simply becomes more bureaucratic.”
He does write that President Obama’s health-care overhaul could eliminate duplicative services, and that health-care benefit exchanges will provide patients with competitive plan options.
But Mr. Dean writes that in order to have a secure future, the country has to move away from fee-for-service medicine, “which is all about incentives to spend more, and has no incentives in the system to keep patients healthy. The IPAB has no possibility of helping to solve this major problem and will almost certainly make the system more bureaucratic and therefore drive up administrative costs.”
The IPAB was labeled a “death panel” by Republicans in the run-up to the 2010 midterm elections; among its most prominent critics was former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.
On the campaign trail last year, Rep. Paul Ryan, the GOP’s vice presidential nominee, said that with the board, Mr. Obama “puts a board of 15 unelected, unaccountable bureaucrats in charge of Medicare, who are required to cut Medicare in ways that will lead to denied care for current seniors.”
PolitiFact rated the claim “mostly false,” but Mr. Dean has provided some high-profile bipartisan opposition to the board.
“The IPAB will cause frustration to providers and patients alike, and it will fail to control costs,” Mr. Dean wrote. “When, and if, the atmosphere on Capitol Hill improves and leadership becomes interested again in addressing real problems instead of posturing, getting rid of the IPAB is something Democrats and Republicans ought to agree on.”


Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/...#ixzz2baw43IUN

I want more than a link. I want to see your intellect on display.

post a link and its no good

don't post a link and the wingers demand one


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Originally Posted by CJ7

Now JD is threatening me that he will post a link disputing wtf my link said. Like I give a fuck!

Post the link JD.

These guys just try and say the opposite of what ever is said...If I said shit taste awful, they'd start trying to convince us of the wonderful taste of caca.

Well we seem to be at odds about what we're talking about. I, and so many others here, are talking about the result and you seem to be talking about intentions. I can post a link (I thought I already did) that is about the results; death panels (I like that name) are real and though he won't use the name democratic candidate Howard Dean agrees. Sarah Palin, this probably reals burns your ass, has been verified as a truth teller. Now do you want to talk about intentions or reality. Remember what the road to hell is paved with. Just because you are a utilitarian doesn't mean that you can ignore the results.

Here it is from a different source http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/...lth-care-rati/

Former Vermont governor and Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean has had plenty of good things to say about Obamacare, but he does not believe an independent board that can determine health-care cost rates and services — dubbed a “death panel” by its most vociferous detractors — will work as intended.
The Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB) — “essentially a health-care rationing body,” Mr. Dean writes — has “no possibility” of working to curb health care costs and “will almost certainly make the system more bureaucratic and therefore drive up administrative costs.”
“By setting doctor reimbursement rates for Medicare and determining which procedures and drugs will be covered and at what price, the IPAB will be able to stop certain treatments its members do not favor by simply setting rates to levels where no doctor or hospital will perform them,” Mr. Dean writes in a piece in the Wall Street Journal.
There does have to be control of costs in our health-care system, Mr. Dean writes, but rate setting “has a 40-year track record of failure.”
“What ends up happening in these schemes (which many states including my home state of Vermont have implemented with virtually no long-term effect on costs) is that patients and physicians get aggravated because bureaucrats in either the private or public sector are making medical decisions without knowing the patients,” he writes. “Most important, once again, these kinds of schemes do not control costs. The medical system simply becomes more bureaucratic.”
He does write that President Obama’s health-care overhaul could eliminate duplicative services, and that health-care benefit exchanges will provide patients with competitive plan options.
But Mr. Dean writes that in order to have a secure future, the country has to move away from fee-for-service medicine, “which is all about incentives to spend more, and has no incentives in the system to keep patients healthy. The IPAB has no possibility of helping to solve this major problem and will almost certainly make the system more bureaucratic and therefore drive up administrative costs.”
The IPAB was labeled a “death panel” by Republicans in the run-up to the 2010 midterm elections; among its most prominent critics was former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.
On the campaign trail last year, Rep. Paul Ryan, the GOP’s vice presidential nominee, said that with the board, Mr. Obama “puts a board of 15 unelected, unaccountable bureaucrats in charge of Medicare, who are required to cut Medicare in ways that will lead to denied care for current seniors.”
PolitiFact rated the claim “mostly false,” but Mr. Dean has provided some high-profile bipartisan opposition to the board.
“The IPAB will cause frustration to providers and patients alike, and it will fail to control costs,” Mr. Dean wrote. “When, and if, the atmosphere on Capitol Hill improves and leadership becomes interested again in addressing real problems instead of posturing, getting rid of the IPAB is something Democrats and Republicans ought to agree on.”


Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/...#ixzz2baw43IUN

I want more than a link. I want to see your intellect on display. Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

well said ... too bad there's no death panels and you wasted your time ... which is why nobody is wasting their time and intellect arguing with you.

. Sarah Palin, this probably reals burns your ass, has been verified as a truth teller.

. Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Please provide a link that she has been certified/verified as a truth teller. Who certifies truth tellers JD? Tea Turds?

well said ... too bad there's no death panels and you wasted your time ... which is why nobody is wasting their time and intellect arguing with you. Originally Posted by CJ7

JD provides a link that counters his claim(s) does nothing to dispute my link and he wants me to comment on it.

Death panels....a right wing name for self proclaimed idiots. These anti Obamacare people will simply fight Obamacare to the end solely because the hate Obama and democrats. Where was there outrage when W proposed and passed the seniors drug plan? It's been in the red since its inception!!!

Medicare is already "rationed" or what they'd call death panels already. These people are simply idiots. They don't realize the are only a job loss with a medical condition away from being unable to obtain affordable health insurance for themselves and their families. They just don't realize how fortunate they are to have a job at present.

Death panels....a right wing name for self proclaimed idiots. Originally Posted by txrancher1

Oh, so sorry. Let the idiot amend his original statement

Independent Payment Advisory Board? Oh no...that is not part of Obamacare. Sarah Palin was mercilessly ridiculed for even suggesting so. Originally Posted by Chica Chaser

Changes the entire meaning of and function of the panel, of course...now I see what you mean.

If this is all about Obama then why did we also oppose the take over of healthcare by Hillary Clinton? I think you have all been caught in your own lie. This is not about Obama but about healthcare and the free market.

If this is all about Obama then why did we also oppose the take over of healthcare by Hillary Clinton? I think you have all been caught in your own lie. This is not about Obama but about healthcare and the free market. Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Duh! Hillary is the only person the Tea Turds hate as much as Obama.