Statements on this thread have been made that draw an equivalence between "MAGAs" and citizens who support the Second Amendment as it is currently interpreted by SCOTUS. It is interesting to note that during the Obama administration's national discussion of gun control, firearms retailers said that most first time gun buyers were minorities and women . . . the folks who made up large parts of the Democrat'S coalition that put Obama into office. They seemed to be believers in the right to own and poses firerms. . . . .and I believe that most would not delf-identify as 'MAGSAs". There was a similar gun buying surge from the same demographic groups sat the start of the Biden administration during the widespread unrest of the BLM-Antifa riots of 2020. They seemed to be believers in the current interpretation of The Second Amendment too.
Interestingly to me . . . during the Jan 6th events at the Capitol, not one gun was used by or recovered from, any of the so-called rioting insurrectionists. Several hundred "MAGA" citizens were subsequently imprisoned for this or that, but no one was charged with a gun crime.
We can quibble forever about the true meaning of the text of the Second Amendment as written in 1789.
If The Second Amendment is a spurious right not inalienable or preexisting the Constitution . . .why don't the anti-gun crowd want to abolish it? The constitution provides two mechanisms for doing just that.
I say "PUT UP OR SHUT UP".
- ICU 812
- 12-31-2023, 04:52 AM
- SpeedRacerXXX
- 12-31-2023, 08:00 AM
- SpeedRacerXXX
- 12-31-2023, 08:12 AM
Very few, myself included, do not contest the right of people to own guns. However, as I keep reminding people, that right is not absolute. Anyone who disagrees with that statement is wrong based on court decisions, decisions made by even Conservative leaning courts.
Interestingly to me . . . during the Jan 6th events at the Capitol, not one gun was used by or recovered from, any of the so-called rioting insurrectionists. Several hundred "MAGA" citizens were subsequently imprisoned for this or that, but no one was charged with a gun crime.
[/B] Originally Posted by ICU 812
As for your claim that handguns were not present at the January 6 picnic in the park.
"PolitiFact: Tucker Carlson is wrong. Firearms, other weapons at Capitol on Jan. 6"
https://www.statesman.com/story/news...-6/7621149001/
"'Armed insurrection': What weapons did the Capitol rioters carry?"
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...oogle_vignette
There were definitly people on the Capitol grounds with handguns on January 6. No, none were charged with a "gun crime" but some definitely had handguns in their possession and were charged with possession. But since very few were physically searched for weapons that day there may have been many more with handguns than those caught and charged.
- Levianon17
- 12-31-2023, 08:26 AM
- SpeedRacerXXX
- 12-31-2023, 09:18 AM
Fuck the courts they are just violating the Constitution. Besides you probably misinterpreted what they said anyway. Originally Posted by Levianon17I did not misinterpret what they said at all. Look at the FACTS.
States are given the freedom to restrict gun ownership as they see fit. The obvious restriction is age but there are several others. If people in a state disagree with those laws they can take their case throught the court system as has been done several times, some wins some losses.
- Levianon17
- 12-31-2023, 09:46 AM
I did not misinterpret what they said at all. Look at the FACTS.No State can enact any Law restricting the ownership of a Firearm from any citizen of the "Age of Majority" which refers to the threshold of legal adulthood as recognized by Law. Now the State can prohibit Firearm ownership to a Convicted Felon. A Convicted Felon due to the fact of his conviction has given up his/her right to ownership or possession of a Firearm. But arbitrarily no Law can be Constitutionally enacted to prohibit or restrict a Law Abiding citizen from owning or possessing a legal Firearm. It's been tried and failed because it violates the Constitution.
States are given the freedom to restrict gun ownership as they see fit. The obvious restriction is age but there are several others. If people in a state disagree with those laws they can take their case throught the court system as has been done several times, some wins some losses. Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX
- Precious_b
- 12-31-2023, 07:12 PM
Biden isn't even working as hard as Obama did to 'take away our guns' so for anyone whose butthole is puckered in fear of having their firearms abducted I think you would be just as likely to teach pigs how to fly Originally Posted by DNinja69yep. joey is far behind Obama in that. Obama was giving away guns.
- ICU 812
- 01-01-2024, 06:38 AM
No charge, no conviction.
No due process or legal fact-finding.
No due process or legal fact-finding.
- Yssup Rider
- 01-01-2024, 08:59 AM
- ICU 812
- 01-01-2024, 09:34 AM
Very few, myself included, do not contest the right of people to own guns. However, as I keep reminding people, that right is not absolute. Anyone who disagrees with that statement is wrong based on court decisions, decisions made by even Conservative leaning courts.Thank you. I will correct my remarks.
As for your claim that handguns were not present at the January 6 picnic in the park.
"PolitiFact: Tucker Carlson is wrong. Firearms, other weapons at Capitol on Jan. 6"
https://www.statesman.com/story/news...-6/7621149001/
"'Armed insurrection': What weapons did the Capitol rioters carry?"
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...oogle_vignette
There were definitly people on the Capitol grounds with handguns on January 6. No, none were charged with a "gun crime" but some definitely had handguns in their possession and were charged with possession. But since very few were physically searched for weapons that day there may have been many more with handguns than those caught and charged. Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX
No firearms were confiscated from protesters inside the capitol that I am aware of. No one arrested in the4 Capitol was charged with a gun crime. No one inside the Capitol discharg3d a firearm except for one Capiton police officer. One unarmed woman was shot inside the Capitol and killed by Capiton police.
Hrdly an armed insurrection.
- Yssup Rider
- 01-01-2024, 10:17 AM
Thank you. I will correct my remarks.SNCK
No firearms were confiscated from protesters inside the capitol that I am aware of. No one arrested in the4 Capitol was charged with a gun crime. No one inside the Capitol discharg3d a firearm except for one Capiton police officer. One unarmed woman was shot inside the Capitol and killed by Capiton police.
Hrdly an armed insurrection. Originally Posted by ICU 812
- eyecu2
- 01-01-2024, 10:33 AM
If I'm not mistaken, many of the proud boys and a few others questioned did indeed confirm that they had guns stashed nearby for use if required. There were several ppl with multiple guns in cars that were parked near the capital.-(which is illegal by the way in DC. You need permits and they can only be in the home or place of business, and that all firearms must be registered with the metro PD. There are very few ppl given open carry or CCPs in the DC area for obvious political reasons) That they didn't bring them with them is a godsend, but thats like saying a suicide bomber, who wanted to scope out the situation before strapping up his IED, was totally innocent cause he didn't have the bomb on him. The intent of a crime, is part n parcel of committing one. Look at the guys who get nabbed on to catch a predator, By the time Chris Hansen pops up, those guys are guilty and processed as such. They didn't have to actually go through with the crime, it was the planning, the intent and partial follow-through that they get caught. And why some of the proud boys got such big sentences. Mitigating circumstances that they didn't have the fire-arm with them, but that they did in fact bring them to the city- is a crime - intent to cause bodily harm. The status of intent of the mind- criminal intentions.
anyone who participated or helped with the coordination of the same crime, could be charged with conspiracy to the fact. Not all that hard to understand.
anyone who participated or helped with the coordination of the same crime, could be charged with conspiracy to the fact. Not all that hard to understand.
- Levianon17
- 01-01-2024, 04:14 PM
- SpeedRacerXXX
- 01-02-2024, 01:10 PM
No State can enact any Law restricting the ownership of a Firearm from any citizen of the "Age of Majority" which refers to the threshold of legal adulthood as recognized by Law. Now the State can prohibit Firearm ownership to a Convicted Felon. A Convicted Felon due to the fact of his conviction has given up his/her right to ownership or possession of a Firearm. But arbitrarily no Law can be Constitutionally enacted to prohibit or restrict a Law Abiding citizen from owning or possessing a legal Firearm. It's been tried and failed because it violates the Constitution. Originally Posted by Levianon17You should do some research before making such incorrect statements.
For example, 10 states have laws banning assault style weapons.
"Context: California became the first state to enact a ban on assault-style weapons in 1990. Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey and New York followed suit.
Each state delineates its own definition of assault-style weapons in its laws. But the term generally covers the same types of firearms, such as the AR-15-style rifle used in the Uvalde and Highland Park shootings last year.
The District of Columbia has had restrictions in place dating back to 1932.
Several states have faced lawsuits over the bans, however."
And you should remember that there was a federal ban on certain assault style weapons for 10 years, starting in 1994.
"Congress passed a 10-year ban on assault weapons in 1994. A 2019 study found that mass-shooting fatalities were 70% less likely to occur during this period."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/th...an/ar-AA16ePd8
And in 2016 SCOTUS upheld those laws to be valid.
- SpeedRacerXXX
- 01-02-2024, 01:20 PM
Thank you. I will correct my remarks.Thank you for your correction. There were many other weapons found on the protesters other than handguns.
No firearms were confiscated from protesters inside the capitol that I am aware of. No one arrested in the4 Capitol was charged with a gun crime. No one inside the Capitol discharg3d a firearm except for one Capiton police officer. One unarmed woman was shot inside the Capitol and killed by Capiton police.
Hrdly an armed insurrection. Originally Posted by ICU 812
"But a review of the federal charges against the alleged rioters shows that they did come armed, and with a variety of weapons: stun guns, pepper spray, baseball bats and flagpoles wielded as clubs. An additional suspect also allegedly planted pipe bombs by the headquarters of the Democratic and Republican parties the night before the riot and remains at large.
Those weapons brought violence and chaos to the Capitol. Capitol Police officer Brian Sicknick died one day after two rioters allegedly sprayed him and other officers with what prosecutors describe as an "unknown chemical substance." Four other people in the crowd died in the insurrection, and more than 100 police officers suffered injuries, including cracked ribs, gouged eyes and shattered spinal disks."
People committed crimes on January 6, 2021, some very minor and some very major. There were around 2,000 protesters at the Capitol building that day. Far from all faced charges.
An overview of the cases so far
Number of people charged, federal: 1,232
Number of people who have pleaded guilty: 728
Number of individuals who have had jury, bench, or stipulated bench trials: 169
The number with mixed verdicts: 46
The number convicted on all charges: 120
The number acquitted on all charges: 3
Number of people sentenced: 745
The percentage of people sentenced who have received prison time: 64
The median sentence for those who received prison time, in days: 150
The number of cases dismissed: 9 federal
https://www.npr.org/2021/02/09/96547...-their-stories