mm thank you - written by the sanctimonious elitists with superiority complex ( covering for severe inferiority issues). Originally Posted by oeb11
Your welcome....Trumptard
No...actually I wrote that by myself....you need help with your posts?
- matchingmole
- 07-07-2020, 11:11 PM
Your welcome....Trumptard
No...actually I wrote that by myself....you need help with your posts?
- friendly fred
- 07-08-2020, 07:06 AM
A Vaccine is about 9 months away, it should be here by April 2021. No other way out. There is talk that Herd immunity may not even be possible even if 70% of the population gets infected. Originally Posted by adav8s28What about a cure?
If we develop the medical protocols to cure the disease, we don't need the vaccine.
- friendly fred
- 07-08-2020, 07:08 AM
- friendly fred
- 07-08-2020, 07:10 AM
An advisor is not an expert. Like Ivanka is an expert. Right. Dickhead.Alabama is much better than the shithole ghettos created by leftist politicians running the big cities.
Trump administration moves to formally withdraw US from WHO
https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...s-us-from-WHO-
How fragile is this idiot's ego? How thin is his skin? How much more isolated can we get from the world without looking like the Alabama of the Earth? Originally Posted by eccieuser9500
- LexusLover
- 07-08-2020, 08:29 AM
How is herd immunity achieved by injecting everyone with a toxic substance commonly referred to as a vaccine, ..... Originally Posted by Levianon17That's not my understanding from listening to the physicians who have dealt with epidemics overseas ... and in this country.
It has to do with developing a natural immunity by interacting with the infected members of "the herd" ... not by injected exposure. Eventually the virus "starves" out and becomes weak due to an inability to infect others and develop into a stronger virus. These viruses rarely remain the same ... they morph.
- Why_Yes_I_Do
- 07-08-2020, 10:47 AM
You have no consensus, no science and no freak'n clue.
Try wrapping your Tiny mind around this ID-10-T's guide to the physics of the loogie and compare to the best masks that filter down to the 3 micron level, inward only- mostly, while the worst masks are nowhere near that level of filtering and that is not counting the poor fit of most masks (bypass) to begin with.
Science: Masks and Aerosols, by Karl Denninger
Let’s look at physics and mathematics folks.
We’ll start with a single cough or sneeze.
Everyone “knows” that if you cover a cough or sneeze, and you should do it into your sleeve instead of your hand, this will reduce the risk of someone else getting a virus you may have, right?
Wrong.
It doesn’t. So says the science! This is a myth, just like it is a myth that you can wear a mask and reduce transmission.
Wait — you say! YUCK; that’s obvious that it helps.
Well, no.
Here’s why.
You sneeze and a huge loogie comes out your nose. Yuck! Nasty! Mucus, full of germs.
It goes, if uncovered…… downward, on the floor.
And harms nobody.
It’s disgusting, but that’s it. You should still do it anyway because it’s disgusting not to, but you won’t stop a virus by doing so.
What? If I stop the loogie then how come that doesn’t do anything?
Because in addition to the loogie out come a bunch of large drops, each also laden with virus. Maybe a few hundred drops. Yuck! Thus covering or physically blocking those will reduce transmission to other people, right?
Wrong again, statistically speaking.
Why?
Because in that same forceful exhale are an enormous number of sub-micron water droplets that are formed as the saturated vapor in your lungs (100% RH in expired air) cools slightly as it travels up from the lungs to the trachea and out the mouth or nose and comes into contact with the ambient air (well, unless it’s over 98.6F in the air where you are anyway!)
Remember your basic physics: As any saturated vapor cools it condenses. Any saturated vapor that cools by even a tiny amount will condense — that is, coalesce the individual vapor molecules into larger aggregates.
Ordinary “tidal volume” (that is, the amount of air you move in a resting condition with each inhalation) is about 500ml. For a cough or sneeze it is much larger; the maximum volume of air that can be inspired in adult human lungs typically is in the range of 4-6L, or eight to 12 times the “at rest” breathing amount.
When we breathe normally we produce very few or no large droplets. When we sing, play a wind instrument, yell, scream, cough or sneeze we produce a fairly large number of them.
But none of this matters at all, statistically, because with each breath we produce millions of small condensate drops, and all of them which do not aggregate beyond the pore size of the medium in a mask will go right through said mask in either direction, most of those condensed molecules are produced between the lungs and either before or just after exit from the body due to condensation of the 100% RH water vapor and each of them, if you are infected with a virus, carries enough virons to infect another person.
We’ve all “seen our breath” outside when it’s cold.
That’s aggregation and condensation to a great enough degree that the aggregates are visible; there are thousands to millions more said aggregates that are too small to see and when it’s not cold outside none of them aggregate and condense sufficiently to be visible but they are all still there.
This is why physics says that masks don’t work against viruses and exactly zero RCTs show that they do.
Never mind the repeated attempts to do so including in 1918, which did nothing to prevent the spread.
Every single person that has ever “seen their breath” in the winter months knows, if they think about it for 30 seconds, why masks can’t work and don’t.
They can’t work because blocking 1,000 pretty-large droplets sounds like it’s great except hundreds of thousands or even millions of condensed water vapor molecule clusters were also expelled, they have enough virons on them to infect another person and very nearly zero of those are caught by the mask in either direction. Worse, every one of those, unless condensed out or breathed in by someone else can remain in the air for hours since they are small enough to remain within the purview of brownian motion of air molecules; that is, they “float” so to speak because the energy of said molecular vibration and ordinary air currents, even indoors, is large compared to the pull of gravity toward the ground and thus they remain suspended in the air.
Try wrapping your Tiny mind around this ID-10-T's guide to the physics of the loogie and compare to the best masks that filter down to the 3 micron level, inward only- mostly, while the worst masks are nowhere near that level of filtering and that is not counting the poor fit of most masks (bypass) to begin with.
Science: Masks and Aerosols, by Karl Denninger
Let’s look at physics and mathematics folks.
We’ll start with a single cough or sneeze.
Everyone “knows” that if you cover a cough or sneeze, and you should do it into your sleeve instead of your hand, this will reduce the risk of someone else getting a virus you may have, right?
Wrong.
It doesn’t. So says the science! This is a myth, just like it is a myth that you can wear a mask and reduce transmission.
Wait — you say! YUCK; that’s obvious that it helps.
Well, no.
Here’s why.
You sneeze and a huge loogie comes out your nose. Yuck! Nasty! Mucus, full of germs.
It goes, if uncovered…… downward, on the floor.
And harms nobody.
It’s disgusting, but that’s it. You should still do it anyway because it’s disgusting not to, but you won’t stop a virus by doing so.
What? If I stop the loogie then how come that doesn’t do anything?
Because in addition to the loogie out come a bunch of large drops, each also laden with virus. Maybe a few hundred drops. Yuck! Thus covering or physically blocking those will reduce transmission to other people, right?
Wrong again, statistically speaking.
Why?
Because in that same forceful exhale are an enormous number of sub-micron water droplets that are formed as the saturated vapor in your lungs (100% RH in expired air) cools slightly as it travels up from the lungs to the trachea and out the mouth or nose and comes into contact with the ambient air (well, unless it’s over 98.6F in the air where you are anyway!)
Remember your basic physics: As any saturated vapor cools it condenses. Any saturated vapor that cools by even a tiny amount will condense — that is, coalesce the individual vapor molecules into larger aggregates.
Ordinary “tidal volume” (that is, the amount of air you move in a resting condition with each inhalation) is about 500ml. For a cough or sneeze it is much larger; the maximum volume of air that can be inspired in adult human lungs typically is in the range of 4-6L, or eight to 12 times the “at rest” breathing amount.
When we breathe normally we produce very few or no large droplets. When we sing, play a wind instrument, yell, scream, cough or sneeze we produce a fairly large number of them.
But none of this matters at all, statistically, because with each breath we produce millions of small condensate drops, and all of them which do not aggregate beyond the pore size of the medium in a mask will go right through said mask in either direction, most of those condensed molecules are produced between the lungs and either before or just after exit from the body due to condensation of the 100% RH water vapor and each of them, if you are infected with a virus, carries enough virons to infect another person.
We’ve all “seen our breath” outside when it’s cold.
That’s aggregation and condensation to a great enough degree that the aggregates are visible; there are thousands to millions more said aggregates that are too small to see and when it’s not cold outside none of them aggregate and condense sufficiently to be visible but they are all still there.
This is why physics says that masks don’t work against viruses and exactly zero RCTs show that they do.
Never mind the repeated attempts to do so including in 1918, which did nothing to prevent the spread.
Every single person that has ever “seen their breath” in the winter months knows, if they think about it for 30 seconds, why masks can’t work and don’t.
They can’t work because blocking 1,000 pretty-large droplets sounds like it’s great except hundreds of thousands or even millions of condensed water vapor molecule clusters were also expelled, they have enough virons on them to infect another person and very nearly zero of those are caught by the mask in either direction. Worse, every one of those, unless condensed out or breathed in by someone else can remain in the air for hours since they are small enough to remain within the purview of brownian motion of air molecules; that is, they “float” so to speak because the energy of said molecular vibration and ordinary air currents, even indoors, is large compared to the pull of gravity toward the ground and thus they remain suspended in the air.
Draconian. I KNOW! BUT: Consensus says mandatory face coverings will dramatically reduce infection rates.
Lev, you wear the mask out in public only. When in your own confined space, (car, home or backyard) no need. When you put others at risk, you get the whole "it causes Autism" argument.
It is your right not to wear it (get vaccinated), but you put others at risk. I've heard freedom isn't free. Just one example here.
Make it mandatory while in public, then the rates will drop. That's how we get out of the shit.
Coronavirus: Wear masks in crowded public spaces, says science body
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-53316491
We're in this together. Originally Posted by eccieuser9500
- Why_Yes_I_Do
- 07-08-2020, 11:07 AM
Draconian. I KNOW! BUT: Consensus says mandatory face coverings will dramatically reduce infection rates.... Originally Posted by eccieuser9500False and a product of a constantly moving goal post. Recall it used to be about the Death rate, IFR or case fatality rate, CFR, except now it is not actual and verified cases, but includes "probable" cases as well as cases that came from Antibody tests . Hopefully, you can have someone read it to you.
By the buy; the below was written on May 24, 2020, which was 5 days before Ofc. Chauvin was charged will killing Floyd, which kicked off about 21+ days of protesting. VIOLA! Here we are with a surging "probable" case rate, without even a trace recollection that COVID has a 14-21 day incubation period.
Texas DSHS Issues New Guidance for "Probable" COVID-19 Cases
According to guidance provided by the Texas Department of State Health Services (DSHS), Texas will soon begin implementing a new definition for COVID-19 cases that has the potential to significantly and artificially increase case totals.
Prior to this new guidance, Collin County and Texas have been reporting “confirmed” cases based upon laboratory PCR (polymerase chain reaction) tests which detect SARS-CoV-2 RNA in a clinical specimen.
According to DSHS, Texas will now begin reporting “probable” cases in addition to “confirmed” cases. To qualify as a "probable" COVID-19 case, a person must meet any two of three criteria categories:
• Clinical Criteria
• Epidemiologic Linkage Criteria
• Presumptive Laboratory Evidence Criteria
The problem with this new "probable" definition strategy is in the details.
First, take a look at the Epidemiologic Linkage Criteria. There are four possible options for a person to meet this requirement. But #3 is the critical one.
Epidemiologic Linkage Criteria
Patient meets the epidemiologic linkage criteria if she has had one or more of the following exposures in the 14 days prior to onset of symptoms:
• Close contact with a confirmed or probable case of COVID-19
• Close contact with a person with clinically compatible illness AND linkage to a confirmed case of COVID-19 disease
• Travel to or residence in an area with sustained, ongoing community transmission of COVID-19.
• Member of a group defined as high risk during an outbreak (ex. symptomatic residents of a nursing home where at least one laboratory confirmed COVID-19 case has been identified).
Any person who resides in an area with sustained, ongoing community transmission of COVID-19 meets the standard for the Epidemiologic Linkage Criteria. Because we now have sustained, ongoing community transmission of COVID-19 in Collin County, every resident of the county meets this criteria.
Therefore, every resident of Collin County who also meets either the Clinical Criteria or the Presumptive Laboratory Evidence Criteria will now be considered a "probable" COVID-19 case.
Now look at the Clinical Criteria.
Clinical Criteria
Patient meets the clinical criteria if no alternative diagnosis is more likely, and patient meets one of the three criteria below:
• At least two of the following symptoms are present: Headache, sore throat, fever (measured or subjective), chills, rigors, myalgia, or new olfactory and taste disorder(s)
• At least one of the following symptoms are present: Cough, shortness of breath, or difficulty breathing
• Patient has severe respiratory illness with either (a) clinical or radiographic evidence of pneumonia, or (b) acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS)
Any Collin County resident who exhibits two minor symptoms, or exhibits one major symptom, or has clinical evidence of pneumonia, and does not have a more likely diagnosis, will meet the Clinical Criteria in addition to the Epidemiologic Linkage Criteria and will become a "probable" COVID-19 case.
It is also possible to meet the definition of a "probable" COVID-19 case without exhibiting any symptoms at all, by meeting the Epidemiologic Linkage Criteria and the Presumptive Laboratory Evidence Criteria. Any Collin County resident who tests positive for IgG (Immunoglobulin G) or IgM (Immunoglobulin M) on an antibody test will meet two of the three criteria and will also become a "probable" COVID-19 case.
Presumptive Laboratory Evidence Criteria
• Detection of a specific antigen (Ag) or a specific antibody (IgG or IgM) in serum, plasma, or blood.
Lastly, the state is also changing the manner in which COVID-19 related deaths are reported. Currently, a death in our community is reported as COVID-19 related only if a laboratory test had been completed and confirmed. Under the new DSHS guidance, any individual whose death certificate lists COVID-19 as a cause of death or a significant condition contributing to death (even when no confirmatory laboratory testing was performed) will be included in the COVID-19 death totals.
There are significant reasons to be concerned with this new reporting criteria, both for “probable” cases and COVID-19 related deaths.
First, the very nature of the “probable” case definition has the potential to cause a spike in the number of cases, many of which will likely be false positives. As businesses, families, and institutions work diligently towards reopening, the artificial increase in COVID-19 cases will undoubtedly increase the anxiety level for many in our community, while leading others to distrust the reports provided by the state health department. The new definition will also cause additional people to be subject to quarantine orders, some for such insignificant reasons as (1) residing in Collin County and (2) having shortness of breath. Others who don't want to risk a false diagnosis of COVID-19 will be tempted to conceal symptoms like headaches, fever, and coughing. None of these help us stop the spread of COVID-19, nor do they strike a prudent balance between public health priorities and individual concerns.
Second, this new strategy places a counterproductive stress on our public health department resources, as every new “probable” case must be investigated in the same manner as a confirmed case, and contact tracing of “probable” cases will lead to bloated lists of persons under monitoring.
The introduction of this new “probable” case definition does not serve the public good or our public health. This is not the way to keep our communities healthy.
- oeb11
- 07-08-2020, 11:17 AM
An advisor is not an expert. Like Ivanka is an expert. Right. Dickhead.
Trump administration moves to formally withdraw US from WHO
https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...s-us-from-WHO-
How fragile is this idiot's ego? How thin is his skin? How much more isolated can we get from the world without looking like the Alabama of the Earth? Originally Posted by eccieuser9500
as fragile, isolated, and uninformed as a Noam Chomsky acolyte living in mom's basement in austin, Tx.
Or, more likely Seattle CHAZ these days.
Good riddance to the CCP and Comrade Xi dominated WHP and its Ethiopian chinese stooge head Tedros Adhanom
They at minimum participated in the Chinese crime of releasing Wuhan virus on the world - and at worst coordinated it with Chairman Xi.
- Why_Yes_I_Do
- 07-08-2020, 11:26 AM
Draconian. I KNOW! BUT: Consensus says mandatory face coverings will dramatically reduce infection rates. Originally Posted by eccieuser9500Seems as though the CDC wandered off of the plantation - again.
Release the hounds boys!! We gots us a runner!!
Published May 2020
Nonpharmaceutical Measures for Pandemic Influenza in Nonhealthcare Settings—Personal Protective and Environmental Measures
...There were 3 influenza pandemics in the 20th century, and there has been 1 so far in the 21st century. Local, national, and international health authorities regularly update their plans for mitigating the next influenza pandemic in light of the latest available evidence on the effectiveness of various control measures in reducing transmission. Here, we review the evidence base on the effectiveness of nonpharmaceutical personal protective measures and environmental hygiene measures in nonhealthcare settings and discuss their potential inclusion in pandemic plans. Although mechanistic studies support the potential effect of hand hygiene or face masks, evidence from 14 randomized controlled trials of these measures did not support a substantial effect on transmission of laboratory-confirmed influenza. We similarly found limited evidence on the effectiveness of improved hygiene and environmental cleaning. We identified several major knowledge gaps requiring further research, most fundamentally an improved characterization of the modes of person-to-person transmission...
...We conducted systematic reviews to evaluate the effectiveness of personal protective measures on influenza virus transmission, including hand hygiene, respiratory etiquette, and face masks, and a systematic review of surface and object cleaning as an environmental measure...
...In our systematic review, we identified 10 RCTs that reported estimates of the effectiveness of face masks in reducing laboratory-confirmed influenza virus infections in the community from literature published during 1946–July 27, 2018. In pooled analysis, we found no significant reduction in influenza transmission with the use of face masks...
Heh Rocky. Watch me pull a rabbit outta my keester...
- oeb11
- 07-08-2020, 11:30 AM
Originally Posted by eccieuser9500 
Draconian. I KNOW! BUT: Consensus says mandatory face coverings will dramatically reduce infection rates.
Wuhan virus is out of the box - and will move through infecting the population until we reach "her immunity" levels - which will vary with area and living styles.
ultimately - masks may SLOW the rate of progrssion of infection through the population - but will not prevent infections occurring in the long run.
It does help out the medical system from being overwhelmed - but prolongs the pandemic - and the controlling DPST officials do love to exercise their control.
Just as Noam Chomsky loves to publish Lies for consumption by his foolish acolytes.
Draconian. I KNOW! BUT: Consensus says mandatory face coverings will dramatically reduce infection rates.
Wuhan virus is out of the box - and will move through infecting the population until we reach "her immunity" levels - which will vary with area and living styles.
ultimately - masks may SLOW the rate of progrssion of infection through the population - but will not prevent infections occurring in the long run.
It does help out the medical system from being overwhelmed - but prolongs the pandemic - and the controlling DPST officials do love to exercise their control.
Just as Noam Chomsky loves to publish Lies for consumption by his foolish acolytes.
- Levianon17
- 07-08-2020, 11:37 AM
That's not my understanding from listening to the physicians who have dealt with epidemics overseas ... and in this country.Well that's sort of my point. Everyone is hoping a vaccine can be ushered out as to prevent people from getting it, which has never been the case. Like the old saying goes, "only the strong survive" some people will get it and whip it and move on. Others will die, simply the laws of nature.
It has to do with developing a natural immunity by interacting with the infected members of "the herd" ... not by injected exposure. Eventually the virus "starves" out and becomes weak due to an inability to infect others and develop into a stronger virus. These viruses rarely remain the same ... they morph. Originally Posted by LexusLover
- sportfisherman
- 07-08-2020, 11:41 AM
How do we get out of this shit ? Any ideas ?
I have one.Elect a new President in November.
These Chump supporters have TDS.They will go to extravagant lengths to contort into a continued support of Chump.An unbelievable list of conspiracy bullshit and purported hoax crap.
1.Discredit testing.
2.Discredit masks
3.Discredit social distancing
4.Demonize China,the press,Obama (as if he still has anything to do with it),Governors,Mayors,CDC,WHO,e tc.
It seems Everybody is fucked up except of course Chump and his Chumpettes.And they represent about 30-40% of the voting population.
Chump is done !!
I have one.Elect a new President in November.
These Chump supporters have TDS.They will go to extravagant lengths to contort into a continued support of Chump.An unbelievable list of conspiracy bullshit and purported hoax crap.
1.Discredit testing.
2.Discredit masks
3.Discredit social distancing
4.Demonize China,the press,Obama (as if he still has anything to do with it),Governors,Mayors,CDC,WHO,e tc.
It seems Everybody is fucked up except of course Chump and his Chumpettes.And they represent about 30-40% of the voting population.
Chump is done !!
- oeb11
- 07-08-2020, 11:57 AM
Welcome the new brave world of the soylent Green New Deal and radical socialism, k
OBLM terrorists rampaging the streets uncontrolled.
your home, job,car, and clothes will all be confiscated to the Socialist government and re-issued new government level replacements - well maybe replacements - maybe not - but confiscating the means of production and all property is a given.
Be careful what you ask for.
OBLM terrorists rampaging the streets uncontrolled.
your home, job,car, and clothes will all be confiscated to the Socialist government and re-issued new government level replacements - well maybe replacements - maybe not - but confiscating the means of production and all property is a given.
Be careful what you ask for.
- nevergaveitathought
- 07-08-2020, 12:05 PM
the hope for America rests more in the conservative side than in the dimocrat side
that is undeniable truth numero uno
does that mean trump is right about everything ,,,no
but it does mean americans have no alternative
an aged and mentally frail joe biden, who never held a single guiding principle in his life, will not and cannot stand up to the people determined to destroy the republic and its constitution
the entire democrat party has become an enemy of the republic, sad but true.
just listen to your congress people, listen will you?
people who claim white people are biologically deficient and have racism in their dna and who have mistaught teenaged girls and boys to hate themselves and America. people who fire you and discard you when you dare express an independent thought.
todays Marxist proscriptions for life in America remind me of the stories of american pows held by the north vietnamese, the pows couldn't talk to each other, they found ways to communicate by tapping, when the left takes over fully here, no one will be able express themselves, now in corporate america its already here, these corporate frightened miserable weasels are afraid and want to protect their own dollar signs
yes there does need to be a revolution in America, its in the education system and in colleges
that is undeniable truth numero uno
does that mean trump is right about everything ,,,no
but it does mean americans have no alternative
an aged and mentally frail joe biden, who never held a single guiding principle in his life, will not and cannot stand up to the people determined to destroy the republic and its constitution
the entire democrat party has become an enemy of the republic, sad but true.
just listen to your congress people, listen will you?
people who claim white people are biologically deficient and have racism in their dna and who have mistaught teenaged girls and boys to hate themselves and America. people who fire you and discard you when you dare express an independent thought.
todays Marxist proscriptions for life in America remind me of the stories of american pows held by the north vietnamese, the pows couldn't talk to each other, they found ways to communicate by tapping, when the left takes over fully here, no one will be able express themselves, now in corporate america its already here, these corporate frightened miserable weasels are afraid and want to protect their own dollar signs
yes there does need to be a revolution in America, its in the education system and in colleges
- oeb11
- 07-08-2020, 12:07 PM
NGIT - Agreed!