Got to love Bernie...

Didn't I just point out one of your many shortcomings is a complete lack of imagination? You're so fucking unimaginative that all you can do is repeat what others say about you, sewer rat.

And when it comes to understanding conservatve thinking and economics,, you are beyond clueless. The essence of capitalism is dynamic change - the constant creation of new products, new markets, new processes,, new inventions, new ways to generate wealth and improve our living standards. True capitalists don't fear change or cling to the status quo - the truth is exactly the opposite. They promote change and usurp the status quo. They have the vision to come up with new, better and more efficient ways of producing and delivering products and services all the time. The people who try to obstruct these changes are the unimaginative unions, who are in bed with the vision-less libtarded democrats. The only thing they know is how to push up the cost of labor and then resist whenever companies try to roll out smart new labor-saving technologies.

You don't want to discuss the genius of capitalism, do you sewer rat? It "goes beyond rules and boundaries into places that make you uncomfortable" - and we all know what an anal uptight jackass you are. Plus you don't understand a whit of it. When it comes to economics, you have everything upside down. It's conservatives who embrace capitalism as a powerful change engine while the libtards cling pathetically to the past.

A hundred years ago, clueless morons like you were out fighting for a "living wage" for workers in the buggy-whip industry.

. Originally Posted by lustylad

Smart, labor-saving technologies? You must be referring to the Chinese Capitalism as a powerful change engine? You're drinking your own shit now. New better and more efficient ways of delivering and producing products? Yeah, by outsourcing everything and turning us into a service economy that produces jack shit. You're laughable in your delusion. Conservatism, by its very definition, is anything but seeking change or usurping the status quo.

The buggy whip analogy is “an obscurity sitting on an anachronism”

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/10/bu...digi.html?_r=0

Oh, he's still fighting for a "living wage" for those that make whips for the BDSM crowd and those , like him, that "whip it good " at the 'holes !

Says who? You?

I'm not bitching for the sake of bitching. Somebody needs to get some fuckers in a room and have them come up with the fucking number and then make it so.

Can't be undefinable Originally Posted by WombRaider

You really are a clueless fool. Do you realize that most people in this country are employed by small businesses? Not the mega corporations you love to criticize for how they pay their employees and the CEO. Small businesses are not giving their CEO’s millions in bonuses or salary. Many small businesses are barely surviving this stellar economic recovery. You say that you are not smart enough to put a number on the “living wage” you say we need. Why not? It’s a dollar amount and should be easily defined. The reason you can’t put a number on it is because there is no such thing. (Also because you made a complete fool of yourself on the CEO pay discussion) The poor will always be with us. You cannot legislate the end of poverty. If you raised the minimum wage to $20 PH then companies would need to raise their prices to offset the added expense. The employee making minimum wage would still be poor because all of the products they buy cost more. Is that clear enough for you?
Capitalism has pulled more people out of poverty than any other form of government in the history of the world. It doesn’t guarantee success but it does provide the opportunity to try. You want to place the blame for all the poor on the conservatives and none on the poor themselves. There are many things that contribute to their economic circumstances and a major reason is their lack of effort to improve their situation. Here are a few things that would improve their chance of success.

1. Get an education. College isn’t for everyone but if you decide to drop out of school then get a job in an industry / trade where you will be able to move up the ladder. Flipping burgers isn’t it. Get in the construction industry and bust your ass. You can move up the ladder quickly if you have a good attitude and work ethic.

2. Look presentably. Pull your fucking pants up. Cut your damn hair. Quit covering yourself with tats that can’t be hidden with standard clothing.

3. Get your ass out of bed before noon. Laying around bitching and moaning about how tough it is won’t improve your situation.

4. Speak proper English. Don’t be surprised when you don’t get the job when you show up looking and talking like a thug.

5. Show the fuck up on time with a good attitude. Most positions in the workforce are not that complicated. I would hire someone with zero experience if they show the above traits over someone with experience and a shitty attitude.

6. Last but not least. Quit buying shit you can’t afford. You don’t need the latest iphone. You don’t need the 80” flat screen TV. You sure as fuck don’t need the gold rims on your car. Try living within your means and quit blaming your situation on others. You made your own decisions. Not me or anyone else.

WR, you want to tell us that we just don’t care about the poor, the environment, the country and any other topic if we don’t agree with your socialistic views. You say we have no ideas or solutions which is bullshit. You just don’t like our ideas and solutions. IMO the left is responsible for many of the problems we face. After decades of the left’s policies we are on the brink of becoming a country without a future. The United States was and still is the greatest country this world has ever seen but that is not a guarantee that we will always be the best. If you think socialism is such a great form of government then pack your shit and move to one of your choosing. Quit trying to change this country into a second rate country. Take your socialistic views and shove them up your ass.

Where did you copy and paste that from? You simply accept the fact that companies will have to raise prices to adjust to the added expense. Here's a novel idea; maybe they don't make QUITE as much profit. Why is that never a consideration? It's always the little man who gets handed the bag of shit. When a CEO gets a $25 million bonus, where does that money come from? Is that cost passed on to the consumer? It's complete bullshit. You act as if the rules are inflexible, when they simply aren't. You adhere to them because that's the way it has progressed. It's time to examine new ways of doing things.

I don't deny Capitalism as a necessary historical development, but we will evolve past it. We don't still employ the Feudal system, do we? As society evolves and as humans evolve, we will move past it. The industrial revolution and laissez-faire capitalism, with little or no regulation, built the base of what we now enjoy, but at what cost? It built it on the backs of the poor. That fact can't be ignored. We like to focus on the titans, but we forget the millions upon millions of workers that made it possible. Workers who faced awful and often dangerous working conditions for very little pay. Regardless of the future it provided, it was wrong.

Where did you copy and paste that from? Unlike you I have my own ideas and don't need to copy and paste my thoughts. You ought to try it sometime.
You simply accept the fact that companies will have to raise prices to adjust to the added expense. Here's a novel idea; maybe they don't make QUITE as much profit. Why is that never a consideration? It's always the little man who gets handed the bag of shit. When a CEO gets a $25 million bonus, where does that money come from? Is that cost passed on to the consumer? It's complete bullshit. You act as if the rules are inflexible, when they simply aren't. You adhere to them because that's the way it has progressed. It's time to examine new ways of doing things.

I don't deny Capitalism as a necessary historical development, but we will evolve past it. We don't still employ the Feudal system, do we? As society evolves and as humans evolve, we will move past it. The industrial revolution and laissez-faire capitalism, with little or no regulation, built the base of what we now enjoy, but at what cost? It built it on the backs of the poor. That fact can't be ignored. We like to focus on the titans, but we forget the millions upon millions of workers that made it possible. Workers who faced awful and often dangerous working conditions for very little pay. Regardless of the future it provided, it was wrong. Originally Posted by WombRaider

Forget about the CEO's that get millions in salary and bonuses. In the overall scheme of things they are a drop in the bucket. The vast majority of employees in this country work for small businesses. Are you telling them that they should take less? In many cases they are barely surviving. When I first started my construction company in 1982 there were many weeks I didn't get paid but my employees never missed a paycheck. So after years of hard work and sacrifice the business owner is finally making some money but he should not be able to enjoy the rewards of his labor? You truly are clueless and it is obvious that you have never put your money behind a business. Risk your own capital and then tell me how the profits should be distributed.

You say we will evolve past capitalism yet you want to move to socialism. That's worked so well every place it's tried. There are no poor or misfortunate people in the socialist utopias of the world. Compare our poor to the poor of other countries and you will understand that the poor here are much better off than most poor throughout the world. Can we do better? Of course, but not by the means you and the left want. Your ilk are the reason for many of the ills we currently suffer. Start encouraging people to take some personal responsibility and quit playing the victim. I am sick and tired of everyone blaming others for their poor decisions. This is an epidemic in this country. Not just amongst the poor but in every social class. Young people want what their parents have forgetting that it took them 40 plus years of hard work to get there. So many want everything right fucking now and if they can't have then they whine about how unfair the world is. Tough fucking shit. Get it through your fucking head we can't legislate the end of poverty. It will always be here and the best we can do is give people the opportunity to improve their lives. Trying to do it for them only creates a dependent mentality.

Forget about the CEO's that get millions in salary and bonuses. In the overall scheme of things they are a drop in the bucket. The vast majority of employees in this country work for small businesses. Are you telling them that they should take less? In many cases they are barely surviving. When I first started my construction company in 1982 there were many weeks I didn't get paid but my employees never missed a paycheck. So after years of hard work and sacrifice the business owner is finally making some money but he should not be able to enjoy the rewards of his labor? You truly are clueless and it is obvious that you have never put your money behind a business. Risk your own capital and then tell me how the profits should be distributed.

You say we will evolve past capitalism yet you want to move to socialism. That's worked so well every place it's tried. There are no poor or misfortunate people in the socialist utopias of the world. Compare our poor to the poor of other countries and you will understand that the poor here are much better off than most poor throughout the world. Can we do better? Of course, but not by the means you and the left want. Your ilk are the reason for many of the ills we currently suffer. Start encouraging people to take some personal responsibility and quit playing the victim. I am sick and tired of everyone blaming others for their poor decisions. This is an epidemic in this country. Not just amongst the poor but in every social class. Young people want what their parents have forgetting that it took them 40 plus years of hard work to get there. So many want everything right fucking now and if they can't have then they whine about how unfair the world is. Tough fucking shit. Get it through your fucking head we can't legislate the end of poverty. It will always be here and the best we can do is give people the opportunity to improve their lives. Trying to do it for them only creates a dependent mentality. Originally Posted by Budman

Yeah, just forget about those CEOs and their exorbitant paychecks. I wouldn't want to concentrate on them either if I were you. We aren't talking about small businesses here. You have deftly tried to shift the argument to that, when you know good and goddamn well that isn't what we're talking about. We're talking about corporations and the inequality of influence when it comes to capital.

Our poor are better off than other poor? That's the BEST you got? Jesus Christ, what a fucking argument to hang your hat on.

You are operating under the false pretense that the market is actually free. There is no free market without government involvement, otherwise it's social darwinism in which the more powerful economic entities(corporations) win. The market is guided by rules, which are created by the government. These rules are heavily in favor of the wealthy, who in turn use their power to buy influence, leaving the little guy with the bag of shit. This includes the small business owner you're so ready to mention. You and every other small business owner hold no weight. You are in favor of the very economic system that holds you down. Why not have economic regulations in place that work for everyone and not just the corporations? That's all I'm asking. Is that not a fair concern? With the ability for these corporations to simply shift operations overseas when the environment becomes untenable, they are taking advantage of opportunities that a small business owner does not have access to. That creates inequality because of the concentration of capital.

Yeah, just forget about those CEOs and their exorbitant paychecks. I wouldn't want to concentrate on them either if I were you. We aren't talking about small businesses here. You have deftly tried to shift the argument to that, when you know good and goddamn well that isn't what we're talking about. We're talking about corporations and the inequality of influence when it comes to capital.

Our poor are better off than other poor? That's the BEST you got? Jesus Christ, what a fucking argument to hang your hat on.

You are operating under the false pretense that the market is actually free. There is no free market without government involvement, otherwise it's social darwinism in which the more powerful economic entities(corporations) win. The market is guided by rules, which are created by the government. These rules are heavily in favor of the wealthy, who in turn use their power to buy influence, leaving the little guy with the bag of shit. This includes the small business owner you're so ready to mention. You and every other small business owner hold no weight. You are in favor of the very economic system that holds you down. Why not have economic regulations in place that work for everyone and not just the corporations? That's all I'm asking. Is that not a fair concern? With the ability for these corporations to simply shift operations overseas when the environment becomes untenable, they are taking advantage of opportunities that a small business owner does not have access to. That creates inequality because of the concentration of capital. Originally Posted by WombRaider

You are operating under the pretense that the fucking government does anything efficiently. They don't. The big corporations that you are so afraid of are not what keeps this economy running. You can bring up a CEO that was grossly overpaid and was incompetent in his job but that is not the norm. I can point out government jobs that have benefits that the common man doesn't get and they are grossly incompetent in their jobs as well. I want smaller government and less intrusion into my life and business. You want bigger government and more regulation into every aspect of my life. You believe that you can spend other peoples money better than they can. I'm asking you again, what is a "living wage"?

There will always be inequality of capital. You can't avoid it. Some people and corporations will always be wealthier than others. That's just the way it is. I don't have any idea what you think will change that other than bigger government. IMO that is the worst thing that can happen.

Below are several things that I believe need to be done.

1. Congress and all elected officials throughout the country should be on term limits.

2. Congress should not be able to exempt themselves from any law they pass.

3. Being in congress should not be a golden parachute in which you are set for life. You are only entitled to the same benefits that social security offers for your time in office.

4. If you are collecting welfare you must be doing something to improve your situation. It can be a job, education or community service.

5. The border needs to be sealed as much as possible. Once that is done we can discuss immigration reform. Until the border is sealed immigration reform is a moot point.

You are operating under the pretense that the fucking government does anything efficiently. They don't. The big corporations that you are so afraid of are not what keeps this economy running. You can bring up a CEO that was grossly overpaid and was incompetent in his job but that is not the norm. I can point out government jobs that have benefits that the common man doesn't get and they are grossly incompetent in their jobs as well. I want smaller government and less intrusion into my life and business. You want bigger government and more regulation into every aspect of my life. You believe that you can spend other peoples money better than they can. I'm asking you again, what is a "living wage"?

There will always be inequality of capital. You can't avoid it. Some people and corporations will always be wealthier than others. That's just the way it is. I don't have any idea what you think will change that other than bigger government. IMO that is the worst thing that can happen.

Below are several things that I believe need to be done.

1. Congress and all elected officials throughout the country should be on term limits.

2. Congress should not be able to exempt themselves from any law they pass.

3. Being in congress should not be a golden parachute in which you are set for life. You are only entitled to the same benefits that social security offers for your time in office.

4. If you are collecting welfare you must be doing something to improve your situation. It can be a job, education or community service.

5. The border needs to be sealed as much as possible. Once that is done we can discuss immigration reform. Until the border is sealed immigration reform is a moot point. Originally Posted by Budman

I disagree about inequality of capital. That is not something we have to put up with. What will change it is regulations that are favorable to everyone and not just big corporations. Regulations aren't about efficiency. The government's ability to be efficient doesn't really come into play in that arena. They simply need to work. I don't believe I can spend anyone's money better than they can. I simply want to quit accepting the status quo because that's the way it's always been or because you don't believe we can do better.

I disagree about inequality of capital. That is not something we have to put up with. What will change it is regulations that are favorable to everyone and not just big corporations. Regulations aren't about efficiency. The government's ability to be efficient doesn't really come into play in that arena. They simply need to work. I don't believe I can spend anyone's money better than they can. I simply want to quit accepting the status quo because that's the way it's always been or because you don't believe we can do better. Originally Posted by WombRaider

So the "living wage" is not that important? What regulations are you concerned with?

I'm still waiting for you to define a "living wage". Care to answer?

So the "living wage" is not that important? What regulations are you concerned with?

I'm still waiting for you to define a "living wage". Care to answer? Originally Posted by Budman

I've answered that question. The fact that you didn't like it isn't my concern. With the right regulations will come a more equitable living wage.

Regulations aren't about efficiency. The government's ability to be efficient doesn't really come into play in that arena. They simply need to work. Originally Posted by WombRaider

More ignorant babbling nonsense from the sewer rat. All we need to do is enact more regulations and they will enforce themselves, right? No need to worry about competence.

Here is a good example of "efficient regulation" from our super-competent regulators at the SEC. We should hire more of them!

https://youtu.be/FOKSkaQoF_I

Best line: "You couldn't find your backside with two hands if the lights were on!"

Bonus question: Which Bernie would be a bigger disaster as President - Sanders or Madoff?



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I've answered that question. The fact that you didn't like it isn't my concern. Originally Posted by WombRaider

No, you didn't. This is your stock evasive non-answer to keep going around in circles about nothing. Why don't you quote your previous post with the definition of "living wage" if you claim to have given it to us already?

(Pssst - Anyone wanna bet the sewer rat's next post will say "you don't get to tell me what to do! Go find it yourself, shitstain!" Keep on spamming and going nowhere.)

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I've answered that question. The fact that you didn't like it isn't my concern. With the right regulations will come a more equitable living wage. Originally Posted by WombRaider

No you haven't. A "living wage" is a number just like the minimum wage is $7.25. You won't answer because you will look like a fool when it is destroyed by simple logic. Just like when you said CEO's should only be able to make a maximum of 12 times what there lowest paid employee makes. It only took about 2 seconds to show the complete idiocy of that statement.

Lusty's got it right, that is your stock answer when you are cornered with no way out. I guess that's the coward in you. Keep up the good work.

No you haven't. A "living wage" is a number just like the minimum wage is $7.25. You won't answer because you will look like a fool when it is destroyed by simple logic. Just like when you said CEO's should only be able to make a maximum of 12 times what there lowest paid employee makes. It only took about 2 seconds to show the complete idiocy of that statement.

Lusty's got it right, that is your stock answer when you are cornered with no way out. I guess that's the coward in you. Keep up the good work. Originally Posted by Budman

No, it isn't just a number, that's the problem. It's not as simple as you want it to be. It's not destroyed by simple logic. Why should CEOs make 475 times more than their lowest paid employee? Answer me that. And don't use the market as an excuse.

Here's a good example of regulations and exactly what I'm talking about.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0S008U20151006