Tiny you are definitely one of the most congenial posters on this board for as long as I've been snooping around. I commend you. Some of these guys can be pretty trying, myself included.
I'd have preferred not to have included Bannon in my clip as he seems really greasy to me so I'll reserve further comment.
My point is that the natural resistance gained from the disease is shown to be greater than resistance from the vaccine. Supported by these two studies. Results are for the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine.
https://www.zmescience.com/medicine/...-israel-finds/
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....24.21262415v1
Different numbers but they are statisically significant, I believe.
I think I've also been writing "mRNA" backwards in here. That's dick move.
I also did a piss poor job of explaining what I meant about the virus' evolution being driven by inefficient vaccines. I'll take another crack. The virus will naturally automatically create some mutations. If they express in the phenotype it can change the characteristics of how the virus functions, including how transmittable it is. A highly effective vaccine kills off both resulting phenotypes while a less efficient one doesn't, missing the ones that replicate more easily in new hosts and therefore selecting for a more infectious virus. That's as succinctly as I can put it. The vaccines don't spawn variants but shape their evolutionary development. The organism will be rewarded for evolving in it's own interest.
The Atlantic piece doesn't prove much in my estimation. It says numerous times that Malone's work was early and important. Seminal was one description I remember. The fact that he might rub some colleagues the wrong way in disagreement or diminish they're contribution doesn't change the import of his work. Hell, I think it was Watson of Crick and Watson was widely regarded as a real horses ass. Could be the other way round. Leibniz claimed for a good portion of his career that Newton stole calculus from him. Turns out Leibniz' writings recently discovered, prove differently.
As far as the clotting issues, I don't know anything about it as I haven't read anything honestly. I won't comment till I have.
Cheers!
Originally Posted by Ducbutter
Well, I'll commend you Ducbutter for being the best informed person here on your side of the fence in the vaccine debate. I ran across the paper you linked to, but nothing that's explained it as well as the ZME science link. Yes, you look to be right, natural immunity offers better protection than vacccine induced immunity. Still ZME makes a very strong case for getting vaccinated.
I believe you're right, a highly effective vaccine would be better, among other reasons because if you could get it into the majority of peoples' arms in a hurry we'd really put a dent in the mutations.
A big part of the problem is not just the mutations, but that immunity wears off too. This happens with natural immunity, but is a bigger problem with the vaccines. I read yesterday, maybe in your ZME link, that people vaccinated in April were holding up better then those vaccinated in January. Ergo the boosters.
A couple of other things I ran across, one in seven children in the UK aged 11 to 17 who tested positive for COVID in England were experiencing three or more symptoms 15 weeks after infection -
https://www.ft.com/content/31c30156-...6-a1b93ccf91a0
Here's one hot off the press, about kidney damage in people infected by COVID,
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...g-hauler-study
The points I'm getting at, this is not necessarily just a disease the old, fat and diabetic need to worry about. It's looking like the benefits of getting vaccinated outweigh the risks for most people. I suspect the CDC's emergency approval for ages 12 and up was wise . Yes though, you and Malone have a point. In the young maybe natural infection is a better way to reach immunity than vaccines.