Asking for discounts...

That is understandable, and I could be nicer. This site is that way, and I also think you have a tone about you that invites it. Could be a Philadelphia thing, it certainly is in character.

As for the business is business thing, altcomedy likened this business to visual or performing arts, and I can see that. But do they demand payment up front? I suspect not. Originally Posted by JohnnyCap

Yeah, Philly you need a thicker skin. Somebody disagreeing with your self-serving point of view does not make them rude.

As for the arts it varies/depends on how you look at it: want to go to watch a performance* you pay on the way in (many times months in advance with really unfavorable cancellation/refund policies) not on the way out if you liked the concert. A piece of art you can look at it all you want for free but if you want t take it home you have to pay.

*I'm not talking about street performers where you can leave a tip after its over if you are so inclined.

Again with the attacks. What I NEED to do is understand I'm dealing with ignorance. Have fun with that.

um....how was that an attack?

Why does everyone feel bad about asking for a discount? I always ask if they are doing a special. I don't want to spend time searching through all their posts to see if they are offering one.
Heck, maybe they just did a 2,000 over night and taking 250 instead of 300 is fine.
Maybe they want to buy something and 200 gets them a lot closer than zero does.
Who knows the reason. Maybe the last few reviews said 200 and her profile says 450, why not ask then.
Maybe they just got ncns for a 3 hour appointment and don't have a back up.
There are lots of reasons they might want to give a discount. There are a lot of reasons they may not. Never hurts to ask.

Again with the attacks. What I NEED to do is understand I'm dealing with ignorance. Have fun with that. Originally Posted by PhillyChik

Nobody is going after you like you went after shysterjon.

You should accept the ignorance and file it in a cabinet with your own.

Why does everyone feel bad about asking for a discount? I always ask if they are doing a special. I don't want to spend time searching through all their posts to see if they are offering one.
Heck, maybe they just did a 2,000 over night and taking 250 instead of 300 is fine.
Maybe they want to buy something and 200 gets them a lot closer than zero does.
Who knows the reason. Maybe the last few reviews said 200 and her profile says 450, why not ask then.
Maybe they just got ncns for a 3 hour appointment and don't have a back up.
There are lots of reasons they might want to give a discount. There are a lot of reasons they may not. Never hurts to ask. Originally Posted by mydallas1

Yes it does, if you ask repeatedly and without a reason. That's more the type of question that is being bitched about.

I am late to this party but I noticed that all of the ladies don't want to haggle and yet in the face of this solid front, some guys see nothing wrong with it. They must be special.

I am late to this party but I noticed that all of the ladies don't want to haggle and yet in the face of this solid front, some guys see nothing wrong with it. They must be special. Originally Posted by awl4knot

True. But that is a gender issue. Women generally don't like to negotiate; men do. This has theorized to be the "real" reason that women make less money in the same jobs than men.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_875650.html

There are two parties to this transaction, and while I have admiration for any provider I see, that doesn't mean that I become a pin cushion, subject to her every will. In short, I see nothing disrespectful in the fact I choose to negotiate.

Lots of love ladies. You keep doing what you do.

Again with the attacks. What I NEED to do is understand I'm dealing with ignorance. Have fun with that. Originally Posted by PhillyChik

What you need is to understand you are dealing with clients, most with education, many with money, and nearly all with opinions. That the latter may differ from your own hardly an ignorant man makes.

I would think referring to your client base as rude and ignorant smacks of silly business. Wait, maybe this business is different...

I guess I always do that. I always at least ask if they are doing any specials. To me 3.0 for an hour seems like the average. What I really don't understand is why their is no discount if the guy provides a place for an out call. Originally Posted by mydallas1

Because the risk for outcall is increased exponentially. One also has to prepare a bit more creatively to make sure she has everything she needs. (think labor to take your car to a shop vs then driving out to you and repairing on location). Many ladies don't really want to do them, for this reason, but won't turn business away so they price it to control demand.

I know I'm a bit late to the discussion, but I didn't see a more direct answer to this.

Because the risk for outcall is increased exponentially. One also has to prepare a bit more creatively to make sure she has everything she needs. (think labor to take your car to a shop vs then driving out to you and repairing on location). Many ladies don't really want to do them, for this reason, but won't turn business away so they price it to control demand.

I know I'm a bit late to the discussion, but I didn't see a more direct answer to this. Originally Posted by Solitaire

Costs more to have Papa John's delivered than it does to pick it up.

That's a bad example. I haven't shopped at Macys in years. Their people use to and maybe still do get paid on sales. So the good ones would give a discount if asked or let them know about up coming sales in am attempt to get more commission in the future.


As an interesting side note. Their was an donut company that delivered donuts to business and put a jar out that basically said leave money for what you think the donut is worth. They said it almost always made them way more money that way.

Wouldn't that be interesting, a provider letting the clients set the price based on perceived value. Originally Posted by mydallas1

I think those arrangements are called "relationships".

Wow, this topic never really changes. It comes up every few months, and the answers seem to coalesce along the same lines each time. Guys who are used to haggling in their world see nothing wrong with doing so here. Guys who are in businesses where they don’t expect to be haggled, don’t do it here. I am clearly in the second category—someone tells me in one way or another that I should give them a lesser price, I walk. I don’t need their business, I know my rates are very competitive compared to my peers, and I have discovered that asking for a discount up front usually means they will have unrealistic expectations throughout our arrangement. I don’t need it, and have more potential clients than I can handle. I wonder how many of the guys who are perfectly fine asking for a discount on a first meeting do this as universally as they claim. I wonder if they walk into a restaurant and tell the waiter they want to pay $20 for a $30 steak.

I also find it interesting that there are a number of folks who think Philly is being negative but seem to believe calling her “self-serving” is polite. The reality is this is not always a polite place—and at times the sharks start circling far more aggressively than they should.

True. But that is a gender issue. Women generally don't like to negotiate; men do. This has theorized to be the "real" reason that women make less money in the same jobs than men.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_875650.html

There are two parties to this transaction, and while I have admiration for any provider I see, that doesn't mean that I become a pin cushion, subject to her every will. In short, I see nothing disrespectful in the fact I choose to negotiate.

Lots of love ladies. You keep doing what you do. Originally Posted by sketchball82

Wow, it isn't often that someone responds to one of my posts with such an easy put away shot.

First, you have taken the discussion away from a business model or style and placed it in the more freighted context of gender. Second, you acknowledge, backed by an impeccable source (lol - the Huffington Post), that women don't like to negotiate.

Yet, despite this clear dislike of negotiation you feel that it is okay for you engage in unwanted behavior? Going back to the gender issue, is it because you are a guy who isn't a "pin cushion, subject to her every will?" What other excuse could you have for ignoring the preferences of women?

I am having a hard time seeing how that isn't disrespectful. Again, Is it because you are a "guy" and therefore superior? And if it isn't disrespectful to ignore a lady's wishes, sometimes clearly stated that her rates are non-negotiable, it isn't a far step to say that there is no disrespect in ignoring her wishes about bedroom activities. Sure, she says no CIM, but I'm no pin cushion and I'm going to push that envelope.

I know that not everyone feels this way, but for me a session with a GFE provider is a two way event and a shared chemistry is essential for me to get the most out of the event. That chemistry is far easier to achieve when the provider enters the session feeling that she is respected and that her boundaries, of all sorts, will be honored. Do you think that you can develop that essential chemistry if the lady thinks you are a grifter looking for a better deal or to win the "haggle?" She may relent and see you but you will get lesser service, so your skills at negotiation get you naught.

Yes, Sketchball82, you are indeed special.

Wow, it isn't often that someone responds to one of my posts with such an easy put away shot.

First, you have taken the discussion away from a business model or style and placed it in the more freighted context of gender. Second, you acknowledge, backed by an impeccable source (lol - the Huffington Post), that women don't like to negotiate.

Yet, despite this clear dislike of negotiation you feel that it is okay for you engage in unwanted behavior? Going back to the gender issue, is it because you are a guy who isn't a "pin cushion, subject to her every will?" What other excuse could you have for ignoring the preferences of women?

I am having a hard time seeing how that isn't disrespectful. Again, Is it because you are a "guy" and therefore superior? And if it isn't disrespectful to ignore a lady's wishes, sometimes clearly stated that her rates are non-negotiable, it isn't a far step to say that there is no disrespect in ignoring her wishes about bedroom activities. Sure, she says no CIM, but I'm no pin cushion and I'm going to push that envelope.

I know that not everyone feels this way, but for me a session with a GFE provider is a two way event and a shared chemistry is essential for me to get the most out of the event. That chemistry is far easier to achieve when the provider enters the session feeling that she is respected and that her boundaries, of all sorts, will be honored. Do you think that you can develop that essential chemistry if the lady thinks you are a grifter looking for a better deal or to win the "haggle?" She may relent and see you but you will get lesser service, so your skills at negotiation get you naught.

Yes, Sketchball82, you are indeed special. Originally Posted by awl4knot

1. There are gender issues in play, like it or not. Providers tend to be women. Hobbyists tend to be men. I don't think that is reasonably disputable.

2. You are correct, I used Huntington Post as a reference because I didn't expect you to call it into credibility. I do not know who is a scholar and frankly Huntington Post is an easier read than a proper peer-reviewed journal. That does not mean its the only source. Along those lines, here are several credible peer-reviewed articles that conclude similar findings from NIH, Harvard, and Berkeley.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20085399

http://hbswk.hbs.edu/item/5207.html

http://www.haas.berkeley.edu/faculty...ompson_ROB.pdf

3. My pin cushion comment was a rebuttal to your logic. You effectively state that you don't negotiate because it's what providers want. I have no problem if you don't wish to negotiate, but that is your choice. I fail to see how this creates a logical imperative, morality-based issue, or ethical issue that relates to me and my hobbying. I chose colorful language to emphasize that it was your choice not to negotiate, which shouldn't affect my choices when I hobby. I did not intend to attack you. I apologize if that's how it read. To the contrary, I respect your opinion and enjoy your posts.

4. "I know that not everyone feels this way, but for me a session with a GFE provider is a two way event and a shared chemistry is essential for me to get the most out of the event. That chemistry is far easier to achieve when the provider enters the session feeling that she is respected and that her boundaries, of all sorts, will be honored. Do you think that you can develop that essential chemistry if the lady thinks you are a grifter looking for a better deal or to win the "haggle?" She may relent and see you but you will get lesser service, so your skills at negotiation get you naught."
- This is well said, and I agree. It is quite possible that she chooses to give me inferior service. Obviously I hope this isn't the case, but if it is then I'm in a position to decide if it was worthy of a repeat, if we should again negoitate, or if I should even give her more money and spend more time with her too. (Yes, I often do this with excellent tips and gifts if my new friend convinces me that she is worth it.)

5. "Yes, Sketchball82, you are indeed special." No need for cheap shots. I think we're better than that.

True. But that is a gender issue. Women generally don't like to negotiate; men do. This has theorized to be the "real" reason that women make less money in the same jobs than men.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_875650.html

There are two parties to this transaction, and while I have admiration for any provider I see, that doesn't mean that I become a pin cushion, subject to her every will. In short, I see nothing disrespectful in the fact I choose to negotiate.

Lots of love ladies. You keep doing what you do. Originally Posted by sketchball82

Anyone who says that women do not like to negotiate have NOT met an asian woman shopping in open markets or chinatown.

The difference is I am willing to negotiate a lower price on a physical good in markets where that is acceptable but I wouldn't dream of trying to haggle down my masseuse, nail tech, or facialist.

For example, when I was installing central air in my old starter home I did not try to negotiate labor and material prices period. I received several estimates and went with the one that was was at a price point I was comfortable with and the person that inspired the most trust. I did however shop around for the air handler and outdoor unit and haggled down the price of items that had dings which I later got fixed gratis by a friend.

Would you tell your tax preparer that you want to pay them a lower fee? How about your barber? I'm sure both of them would feel insulted. It is the same way for the ladies who take pride in themselves. Maybe circumstances will make her accept your offer but I'm sure her heart won't be in it and she will be very guarded with you since you have already set up an expectation of being "pushy".

Of course this all goes out the window if you are speaking of your own financial circumstances changing and having a respectful, honest conversation with your ATF.

Asking if there is a special is generally not going to piss a woman off. Telling her that you want to pay less than her posted rate will if she was not the one who opened the the door to Bargainville.