Sinema stands with her fellow Democrats on social spending and climate bill. It’s a done deal.

Electric vehicles are only for rich people. Lol. Yeah right.

What are you comparing them to as poor peoples vehicles? Or even middle class peoples vehicles. Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Yeah, most poor people drives vehicles from 50-120k. Lol what a tool.

Once again. What are the poor peoples vehicles. And middle class peoples vehicles. You didn’t answer the question.

EVs are a niche product. who could afford it... only those making $200,000 or more.


granted, this is upper middle and above.

https://www.tesla.com/model3

Costs under $50K. Only people making 200+ can afford this? I beg to differ.

https://www.vw.com/en/models/id-4.html

40K. I’m pretty sure you can afford this without earning 200K.

https://www.chevrolet.com/electric/bolt-ev

30K. Once again, no need to be rich to afford.

I’m sure I can find a few more but I think I’ve made my point.

Y’all should really stop lying about EVs being for the rich only. Every time y’all outright lie, you amazingly become even less credible, which is a feat unto itself.

Nevergaveitahthought, maybe we should cut him a break. He's not well. Remember that WTF owns shares in oil and gas midstream companies. I think he said that's something like 70% of his net worth. It's obvious what the Democratic Party, without Manchin, would do to the oil and gas industry. And it's obvious that WTF suffers from Stockholm Syndrome. Stockholm Syndrome is a pernicious disease. Look what it did to Patty Hearst. Originally Posted by Tiny

i would have thought that someone of his foresight, acumen, brilliance and financial prescience would have sold his oil and gas investments at the top

i mean exxon hit what? 110? and now its 89 maybe

stand by for that very claim from him

and his suffering, if he is suffering, pales in comparison to the exasperations he causes others by his leaps from logic

headline in the new york times of all places:

"Electric Cars For Everyone? Not Unless They Get Cheaper"

https://www.tesla.com/model3

Costs under $50K. Only people making 200+ can afford this? I beg to differ.

https://www.vw.com/en/models/id-4.html

40K. I’m pretty sure you can afford this without earning 200K.

https://www.chevrolet.com/electric/bolt-ev

30K. Once again, no need to be rich to afford.

I’m sure I can find a few more but I think I’ve made my point.

Y’all should really stop lying about EVs being for the rich only. Every time y’all outright lie, you amazingly become even less credible, which is a feat unto itself. Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Ok, You don’t have to be rich to buy one. But most people who do are relatively well off. It’s not just the sticker price of the new vehicle.

People who own EV’s also typically own one or more ICE vehicles - much more convenient if you’re going to take a long trip. People who make more money are more likely to have more than one car.

The reason that theoretically it can be cheaper to own an EV over the long haul is because of the tax credits. If you don’t have a large income it’s more difficult to use the tax credit.

Finally there’s not a large number of used EV’s, priced cheaper than your examples. If you don’t want to shell out $30,000+ on a vehicle you don’t have many options.

Here’s an article, EV’s remain mostly out of reach for poor Americans:

https://www.tdworld.com/electrificat...poor-americans

Note they say the average cost in 2019 for an EV was $55600 compared to $36,600 for a new ICV. Admittedly the difference is probably lower now.

is the ev tax credit refundable?

if not, it doesnt help poor people one bit

and poor people are supposed to take on car payments and with interest rates rising as well?

So it’s not that you have to be rich. It is that you choose a similarly as expensive gas vehicle. See that’s called choice. So no need for people to lie about EVs being for the rich or upper class. Truth goes much farther in an argument.

If people rather buy gas vehicles then fine. But don’t lie about their inability to purchase an EV and take advantage of the tax credit. Most people that can afford a new vehicle can afford an EV if they so choose to. This isn’t 2016 when EVs were all 100K and there were no options. People make choices and they should. If the incentive is to buy an EV with a tax credit or not to, that’s a choice.

is the ev tax credit refundable?

if not, it doesnt help poor people one bit

and poor people are supposed to take on car payments and with interest rates rising as well? Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

I’m not an accountant so I’m unsure whether it carry’s over year to year until depleted. It may which would be great even for poor people.

I’m sure you understand how dumb you me last question is and you asked it anyway. If a person can’t afford to have a note, maybe they shouldn’t be purchasing any vehicle. And the ones they can purchase without a note wouldn’t be relevant to the discussion anyway. But I’ll give you credit for not being stupid and that you just nevergaveathought to your question.

I’m not an accountant

I’m sure you understand how dumb you me last question is.... Originally Posted by 1blackman1

nor a brilliant lawyer

how dumb you me? so, just how dumb is you?

I edited my post. Did the part about "the future of the American oil and gas industry" change your mind? That includes midstream. Originally Posted by Tiny

No...pure hyperbole on your part.

Mid streams are going to do great...especially the one I have. You do understand it will take ngl to power these plants that supply electricity?

Nevergaveitahthought, maybe we should cut him a break. He's not well. Remember that WTF owns shares in oil and gas midstream companies. I think he said that's something like 70% of his net worth. It's obvious what the Democratic Party, without Manchin, would do to the oil and gas industry. And it's obvious that WTF suffers from Stockholm Syndrome. Stockholm Syndrome is a pernicious disease. Look what it did to Patty Hearst. Originally Posted by Tiny

I said 70% invested. That is a tad different than net worth.

Patty Hearst only had it for a short time...Ronnie Reagan got you boys preaching nonsense for forty years! "Cut taxes....equates to more tax revenue we can spend!"....and more money you can borrow and spend!

What a way to go through life.

Let us compare

You: Griping about debt that your policy caused. Let's continually cut taxes so we produce more tax revenue!I should tell your employer to cut your pay to get more productivity from you. Same concept you seem to think actually works!

Me: Making money off an analysis of the practical Realpolitik of both parties spending. Which includes investing in mid streams that are now able to ship ngl's to Europe!

So it’s not that you have to be rich. It is that you choose a similarly as expensive gas vehicle. See that’s called choice. So no need for people to lie about EVs being for the rich or upper class. Truth goes much farther in an argument.

If people rather buy gas vehicles then fine. But don’t lie about their inability to purchase an EV and take advantage of the tax credit. Most people that can afford a new vehicle can afford an EV if they so choose to. This isn’t 2016 when EVs were all 100K and there were no options. People make choices and they should. If the incentive is to buy an EV with a tax credit or not to, that’s a choice. Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Take a look at this on inequities in ownership of EV’s based on income and race. The writer says the average income of an owner of an EV in California was $190,000. And only 4% of EV’s in Maryland have black owners, although 30% of the population is black.

Granted, you’re right, there are affordable EV’s although I’d ask if they’re as cheap as similarly equipped ICV’s. And with time more people who aren’t well off will own the vehicles

https://sciencepolicyreview.org/2021...tric-vehicles/

is the ev tax credit refundable?

if not, it doesnt help poor people one bit

and poor people are supposed to take on car payments and with interest rates rising as well? Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

You haven't followed GM and the price points of their Bolt and incoming mid size sun's.

Research before you parrot nonsense fed to you by right wing propaganda sources.

Take a look at this on inequities in ownership of EV’s based on income and race. The writer says the average income of an owner of an EV in California was $190,000. And only 4% of EV’s in Maryland have black owners, although 30% of the population is black.

Granted, you’re right, there are affordable EV’s although I’d ask if they’re as cheap as similarly equipped ICV’s. And with time more people who aren’t well off will own the vehicles

https://sciencepolicyreview.org/2021...tric-vehicles/ Originally Posted by Tiny

Tiny ....you're looking at the past and not the future.

Check out GM's future and present ev lineup.

This was all predictable...

I'll do the research for you and supply you a link...


https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohn...xpected-rival/

And they could soon get even cheaper. A proposed extension of federal EV tax credits is making its way through Congress in the so-called Inflation Reduction Act of 2022. The bill, if passed, could cut the effective base price for a five-passenger Bolt to less than $20,000 through a new $7,500 tax credit, available at the time of purchase.