Police use Taser on 95 year old man in retirement home, then use bean bag round to his gut, which killed him.

. Wiki link source Originally Posted by Stan.Dupp

Mr. Dupp, if you will go back and review my prior posts I mentioned that "non-lethal" LE weapons .... (for liability reasons now referred to as "less-lethal") can cause death, and have .... those include ...

e.g. pepper spray, clubs, batons, choke holds, tasers, rubber bullets, and bean bags....

.. all of those have been provided to avoid the use of the firearm when something else works.

What I recommend is that if you don't want to be subjected to ....

pepper spray, clubs, batons, choke holds, tasers, rubber bullets, or bean bags ....

is to put down your cane and butcher knife (or whatever you are using to threaten) when the police arrive, turn around, put your hands behind your back, and comply with their commands.

That way you will not be all over the internet blogs and hooker boards being discussed....

.. or dead.

Some of you watch way too many TV detective shows and/or

......... play way too many video games for your information.

.... in both instances the officer(s) used generally considered "nonlethal" responses ...

even though Tazers, bean bags, and pepper spray CAN KILL ... just like a cane CAN KILL.

Wrestling the guy to the ground and putting restraints on him "could have" killed him also.

If you want to blame every friggin thing that happens you don't like on police and give everyone else a pass on their behavior ... then so be it, but don't make up lame excuses. Originally Posted by LexusLover

Here, Dupp.

Do you spend a lot of time watching "wrestling" on TV (or live for that matter)? Just asking.

What I recommend is that if you don't want to be subjected to ....

pepper spray, clubs, batons, choke holds, tasers, rubber bullets, or bean bags ....

is to put down your cane and butcher knife (or whatever you are using to threaten) when the police arrive, turn around, put your hands behind your back, and comply with their commands. Originally Posted by LexusLover

yes, because people are so calm & rational when they have the cops called on them.

the guy was 95 years old ....they could have used a better method in trying to collar him.

is your goal now to have someone google and find 52 different cases each year? Originally Posted by JCM800

LOL, these were just a few reported cases, and no, I am not going to spend my time finding 52 cases online...lmao

Just think about those cases that don't get reported by the news. I am sure there are many more instances of deaths concerning the improper use of bean bag bullets.

Just think about those cases that don't get reported by the news. I am sure there are many more instances of deaths concerning the improper use of bean bag bullets. Originally Posted by Stan.Dupp

When I was in high school I was constantly thinking about all that pussy my "friends" were getting that didn't tell me about .... Just think about all that pussy they didn't report to me.

I wouldn't waste your time either . The DOJ does that with the assistance of the FBI.

Blah, blah, blah.

yes, because people are so calm & rational when they have the cops called on them.

the guy was 95 years old ....they could have used a better method in trying to collar him. Originally Posted by JCM800

So, you are admitting the old fart wasn't being "calm & rational" when the cops arrived.

(Evidence of too much watching of detective shows on TV = "trying to collar him")

What do you think they should dump him out on the floor from his wheel chair while snatching the cane and butcher knife out of his hands, then hold him down while pulling his hands behind his back to put on the cuffs?

So he goes into cardiac arrest while being dumped on the floor and handcuffed.

Blah, blah.

And how many guys have you "cuffed" while they were sitting in a wheel chair swinging a cane and threatening you with a butcher knife? Just count the 95-year-old feeble guys.

And how many 95-year-olds wielding a cane and a butcher knife have you "taken down"? Originally Posted by LexusLover

How many have you taken down?

I would be willing to bet that I could take down every 95 year old cane wielding man on earth without have to taser/bean bag him. That you and these cops can not make that same claim speaks volumes about you, not me.

How many have you taken down?
Originally Posted by WTF

I learned a long time ago, while you were still trying to learn to stand up and piss, that people who ask questions back in answer to a simple question of "yes" or "no" or a number.....

would have to answer .... ZERO! (Which is perfect for you!)

So, you go back and sit on the bench. And put a sock in it.

Don't worry ... there is a couple more on here ... who will be joining you soon, I'm sure.

Your "partner" is still struggling with trying to support that ... "average of 1 a week" ... call of his.

what about have a cop flank him on the left and rattle some keys or something to get his attention .....then the other cops grab him from the right.

or why not use that pole that animal control has for loose dogs so they don't have to get too close to him.

either option is better than killing the guy.

either option is better than killing the guy. Originally Posted by JCM800

Do you honestly believe they intended to kill the guy? Please.

You gonna flank a guy swinging a cane and wielding a knife ... and try to restrain him with your hands ... you then snare him with a loop on a pole .. he goes to the floor and you break his neck .... or suffocate him with a loop around his neck ...

all the bullshit has risks ... they used the tools they were assigned .. and the % of deaths is low..... this was an unfortunate (to say the least) turn of events ... a tragedy. The blame lay in the beginning .. of whatever was upsetting the old guy who didn't want to be "handled" by the staff there at the center.

Why wasn't he with the stepdaughter who now wants to make an issue ... for a lawsuit???

You gonna flank a guy swinging a cane and wielding a knife ...

??? Originally Posted by LexusLover

You believe he was wielding a knife ...


And after doing some digging, I found there are two versions of events: The police version, and a new picture that raises questions of whether John Wrana was killed unnecessarily.

The Park Forest police version is that on the night of July 26, John Wrana, a resident of the Victory Centre senior living facility, threatened staff and paramedics with a 2-foot-long metal shoehorn and a metal cane. The police statement neglects to mention that the old man also used a walker, at least according to photographs supplied by Grapsas.

"Attempts were made verbally to have the resident comply with demands to drop the articles, to no avail," the police statement reads. "The resident then armed himself with a 12-inch butcher type kitchen knife."

But lawyer Grapsas says that Wrana's family never saw a knife in his room and that staff also told him Wrana didn't have such a knife.

"So where did the knife come from?" Grapsas asked.

The police statement leaves the impression that the staff was under threat, leaving police with no choice other than to shoot him.


But according to Maria Oliva, an executive with Pathway Senior Living, the staff was kept out of the room after police arrived. So there was no imminent threat to staff.

"The staff was not inside once the police were on the scene," Oliva told us. "At different times the staff were in there, but not when they were called. They (the police) were in charge at that point."

Do you honestly believe they intended to kill the guy? Please.

You gonna flank a guy swinging a cane and wielding a knife ... and try to restrain him with your hands ... you then snare him with a loop on a pole .. he goes to the floor and you break his neck .... or suffocate him with a loop around his neck ...

all the bullshit has risks ... they used the tools they were assigned .. and the % of deaths is low..... this was an unfortunate (to say the least) turn of events ... a tragedy. The blame lay in the beginning .. of whatever was upsetting the old guy who didn't want to be "handled" by the staff there at the center.

Why wasn't he with the stepdaughter who now wants to make an issue ... for a lawsuit??? Originally Posted by LexusLover

You tell us you don't believe the media and we don't have all the "facts".

And yet you are selectively repeating over and over the least believable "fact" in that whole article - the police version of the story that he had a kitchen knife.

You wouldn't answer my questions about what "facts" you thought were false in the media article (whether he was 96, whether he was frail, whether he needed a cane/walker to get around, etc.).

But the one "fact" you don't seem to dispute is the one that bolsters the police story - that somehow the invalid managed to get a knife out of the nursing home kitchen.

Why don't you just admit you ALWAYS side with the cops, no matter how ludicrous their story?

But the one "fact" you don't seem to dispute is the one that bolsters the police story - that somehow the invalid managed to get a knife out of the nursing home kitchen.

? Originally Posted by ExNYer

LL is the only person not to be there that can comment on the 'facts'. This does not make him a hypocrite, just delusional. Well maybe both...

Why don't you just admit you ALWAYS side with the cops, no matter how ludicrous their story? Originally Posted by ExNYer

LL does not look at what was said but who said it. .

Ok.... So... It takes cops being brutal to bring us all together. Well shit balls and crackerjacks batman I think we have a winner.

And I agree with the agreement.

Ok.... So... It takes cops being brutal to bring us all together. Well shit balls and crackerjacks batman I think we have a winner.

And I agree with the agreement. Originally Posted by LovingKayla

LexusLover does not think the Cops were being brutal, just doing their job and doing it well according to LL. By the book.....