This guy apparently was facing 20 years in prison for giving illegal immigrants food and water and advising them on how to self rescue if they encountered a life threatening situation:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/11/u...na-deaths.html
https://www.azcentral.com/story/opin...al/1427696001/
His arrest came shortly after his charitable organization posted a video showing border patrol agents destroying water his group had stashed in the desert.
I don't think he and his group are sheltering illegals. They're not like the underground railroad that helped slaves leave the south, or coyotes or traffickers.
Any thoughts on this? I don't think he should have been prosecuted, for rendering humanitarian aid. About 400 people die crossing the border every year. I'd rather we didn't have illegal immigrants entering the USA. But it's better to have a live illegal here than a dead one in the desert.
- Tiny
- 06-12-2019, 09:19 AM
- nevergaveitathought
- 06-12-2019, 09:35 AM
I had read the AP story, which was almost an editorial instead of straight news
the thought I had was that he and his group aid in, perhaps not getting illegals across, but stand at the ready to help them complete the event, like receiving the baton in a relay race
letting the coyote's get them across but then pick up, hide and aid in dispersing them into the interior
and by doing so , just entice more to make a dangerous trek
didn't seem kosher to me and good Samaritan they don't seem to be, more like scofflaws with a political agenda
but I wasn't interested enough to read all the trial transcript to find out
the hung jury seemed like nullification due to there were some dims and/or prejudicial intransigence on the jury
I have a friend who owns a large ranch in encinal, she came upon a dozen or more illegals on her ranch huddled under the scrub to get out of the sun, she was alone and scared she might have been, but she gave then all her bottled water and food out of the ranch house, and all her canned goods with a can opener for later..she was a good samaritan
the thought I had was that he and his group aid in, perhaps not getting illegals across, but stand at the ready to help them complete the event, like receiving the baton in a relay race
letting the coyote's get them across but then pick up, hide and aid in dispersing them into the interior
and by doing so , just entice more to make a dangerous trek
didn't seem kosher to me and good Samaritan they don't seem to be, more like scofflaws with a political agenda
but I wasn't interested enough to read all the trial transcript to find out
the hung jury seemed like nullification due to there were some dims and/or prejudicial intransigence on the jury
I have a friend who owns a large ranch in encinal, she came upon a dozen or more illegals on her ranch huddled under the scrub to get out of the sun, she was alone and scared she might have been, but she gave then all her bottled water and food out of the ranch house, and all her canned goods with a can opener for later..she was a good samaritan
- gnadfly
- 06-12-2019, 09:45 AM
He's enabling them and should be arrested.
He systematically puts water out along their routes. What's the humanitarian aid for the land owners along the southern border who've been robbed, threaten, injured or killed?
He systematically puts water out along their routes. What's the humanitarian aid for the land owners along the southern border who've been robbed, threaten, injured or killed?
- WTF
- 06-12-2019, 11:05 AM
I had read the AP story, which was almost an editorial instead of straight newsDid you not have anyone befriend you as a child?
the thought I had was that he and his group aid in, perhaps not getting illegals across, but stand at the ready to help them complete the event, like receiving the baton in a relay race
letting the coyote's get them across but then pick up, hide and aid in dispersing them into the interior
and by doing so , just entice more to make a dangerous trek
didn't seem kosher to me and good Samaritan they don't seem to be, more like scofflaws with a political agenda
but I wasn't interested enough to read all the trial transcript to find out
the hung jury seemed like nullification due to there were some dims and/or prejudicial intransigence on the jury
I have a friend who owns a large ranch in encinal, she came upon a dozen or more illegals on her ranch huddled under the scrub to get out of the sun, she was alone and scared she might have been, but she gave then all her bottled water and food out of the ranch house, and all her canned goods with a can opener for later..she was a good samaritan Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought
Jesus the must have beat the compassion outta ya in that orphanage!
- WTF
- 06-12-2019, 11:11 AM
This guy apparently was facing 20 years in prison for giving illegal immigrants food and water and advising them on how to self rescue if they encountered a life threatening situation:I agree with you.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/11/u...na-deaths.html
https://www.azcentral.com/story/opin...al/1427696001/
His arrest came shortly after his charitable organization posted a video showing border patrol agents destroying water his group had stashed in the desert.
I don't think he and his group are sheltering illegals. They're not like the underground railroad that helped slaves leave the south, or coyotes or traffickers.
Any thoughts on this? I don't think he should have been prosecuted, for rendering humanitarian aid. About 400 people die crossing the border every year. I'd rather we didn't have illegal immigrants entering the USA. But it's better to have a live illegal here than a dead one in the desert. Originally Posted by Tiny
Stupid waste of taxpayer dollars.
The policy before was suffice. Jeff Session was probably trying g to get back in Trumps good grace with this bonehead policy shift.
- oeb11
- 06-12-2019, 11:13 AM
It is a fine point of difference between aiding in a humanitarian way, versus enabling illegal migrants being human trafficked into the US ILLEGALLY.
MSM presents this as a humanitarian being persecuted and prosecuted by the Trump administration. Truth is likely different. I am no fan of prosecution for humanitarian aid
Question - Why did Warren not contact Border Patrol to assist in the care and aid of these migrants. Why did he not act to place the migrants in care for medical and hospital care, and in the appropriate legal care of the Border Patrol?
Answer - he did not because he was aiding illegal migration - not just helping in a humanitarian way.
That , to me, IMHO - is a critical difference in the intent of Warren's actions. If he had contacted Border Patrol to help these folks - and aided them until BP arrived - I see no Crime.
That written - agree with Tiny - a live person is better than a dead person in the desert. and, 20 years is far too stiff a sentence for what Warren did. Offer probation, and an opportunity for community service in aid to illegal migrants found on our soil.
MSM presents this as a humanitarian being persecuted and prosecuted by the Trump administration. Truth is likely different. I am no fan of prosecution for humanitarian aid
Question - Why did Warren not contact Border Patrol to assist in the care and aid of these migrants. Why did he not act to place the migrants in care for medical and hospital care, and in the appropriate legal care of the Border Patrol?
Answer - he did not because he was aiding illegal migration - not just helping in a humanitarian way.
That , to me, IMHO - is a critical difference in the intent of Warren's actions. If he had contacted Border Patrol to help these folks - and aided them until BP arrived - I see no Crime.
That written - agree with Tiny - a live person is better than a dead person in the desert. and, 20 years is far too stiff a sentence for what Warren did. Offer probation, and an opportunity for community service in aid to illegal migrants found on our soil.
- WTF
- 06-12-2019, 11:19 AM
It is a fine point of difference between aiding in a humanitarian way, versus enabling illegal migrants being human trafficked into the US ILLEGALLY.To me the fine line is profit.
MSM presents this as a humanitarian being persecuted and prosecuted by the Trump administration. Truth is likely different. I am no fan of prosecution for humanitarian aid
Question - Why did Warren not contact Border Patrol to assist in the care and aid of these migrants. Why did he not act to place the migrants in care for medical and hospital care, and in the appropriate legal care of the Border Patrol?
Answer - he did not because he was aiding illegal migration - not just helping in a humanitarian way.
That , to me, IMHO - is a critical difference in the intent of Warren's actions. If he had contacted Border Patrol to help these folks - and aided them until BP arrived - I see no Crime. Originally Posted by oeb11
He did nothing to profit from these people being here.
You can make a stronger case that Trump himself should be prosecuted for this same crime as he knowingly hired illegal immigrants. For decades!
- oeb11
- 06-12-2019, 11:41 AM
Turning the migrants in to BP would also not be a "profit maker".
- the_real_Barleycorn
- 06-12-2019, 03:15 PM
Since the term "good Samaritan" was used let's look at that usage. As I recall the Samaritan was minding his own business when he came across someone in trouble. He rendered aid. He was not patrolling the roads looking for excitement. This guy was not a good Samaritan. They have laws that recognize someone being put in the situation of rendering first aid without the prerequisite training. They are protected. However, if you are a doctor, nurse, or EMT trained individual you don't have the same protections. You are expected to perform at a certain level of proficiency.
This guy put himself out there, on purpose, to save lives and knowingly break the law. He aided not just illegal aliens but the traffickers as well. He is guilty. He should have rendered aid and called the authorities. Twenty years...harsh but does anyone think he is going to serve that? A message was being sent. He'll be out in five.
This guy put himself out there, on purpose, to save lives and knowingly break the law. He aided not just illegal aliens but the traffickers as well. He is guilty. He should have rendered aid and called the authorities. Twenty years...harsh but does anyone think he is going to serve that? A message was being sent. He'll be out in five.
- WTF
- 06-12-2019, 03:27 PM
- oeb11
- 06-12-2019, 03:39 PM
TBC - agree with your second paragraph.
Good Samaritan law in Texas:
According to The Texas Good Samaritan Act, “a person who in good faith administers emergency care at the scene of an emergency or in a hospital is not liable in civil damages for an act performed during the emergency unless the act is willfully or wantonly negligent.”
Doctors, nurses, and trained first responders are included under the act when acting as a Good Samaritan . Unless Impaired and cause a needless/negligent injury ( Ie Drunk or on drugs), or choose to bill for professional services rendered - which places care-givers under malpractice liability. EMT's responding as part of paid, professional duties are not considered "Good Samaritan responders" - and carry liability for professional action, as well as ,hopefully, liability insurance.
Any person responding to an emergency in a hospital - including - for example- passers- by to a person in cardiac arrest, doctors not involved in the patient's care, etc acting as good Samaritans are not held liable. Nurses in the employ of a hospital responding to a medical emergency are acting under their employment and not considered Good Samaritans.
As I understand that legal arena.
Another way to look at Warren's acts - if he puts out water and food (also littering) - to encourage illegal migration, and puts more innocent people at risk as they expect to find water and food to help them; He is not acting as a Good Samaritan. He is encouraging illegal migration through a risky desert landscape and putting more innocent people at risk.
Good Samaritan law in Texas:
According to The Texas Good Samaritan Act, “a person who in good faith administers emergency care at the scene of an emergency or in a hospital is not liable in civil damages for an act performed during the emergency unless the act is willfully or wantonly negligent.”
Doctors, nurses, and trained first responders are included under the act when acting as a Good Samaritan . Unless Impaired and cause a needless/negligent injury ( Ie Drunk or on drugs), or choose to bill for professional services rendered - which places care-givers under malpractice liability. EMT's responding as part of paid, professional duties are not considered "Good Samaritan responders" - and carry liability for professional action, as well as ,hopefully, liability insurance.
Any person responding to an emergency in a hospital - including - for example- passers- by to a person in cardiac arrest, doctors not involved in the patient's care, etc acting as good Samaritans are not held liable. Nurses in the employ of a hospital responding to a medical emergency are acting under their employment and not considered Good Samaritans.
As I understand that legal arena.
Another way to look at Warren's acts - if he puts out water and food (also littering) - to encourage illegal migration, and puts more innocent people at risk as they expect to find water and food to help them; He is not acting as a Good Samaritan. He is encouraging illegal migration through a risky desert landscape and putting more innocent people at risk.
- WTF
- 06-12-2019, 04:49 PM
Mr. Warren was indicted after Mr. Trump’s first attorney general, Jeff Sessions, directed federal prosecutors to prioritize cases involving the harboring of undocumented immigrants. In the past, the anti-harboring law has been used mainly against smugglers who transport migrants for profit, and occasionally against employers who knowingly recruit undocumented workers.
Mr. Warren’s defense lawyers said that their client was targeted by the Justice Department because No More Deaths had distributed a video showing Border Patrol agents destroying jugs of water that the group had placed in the desert. Mr. Warren was arrested a few hours after the video was posted online. A spokesman for Customs and Border Protection, Robert Daniels, said the agency could not comment during the pending prosecution.
Mr. Warren’s defense lawyers said that their client was targeted by the Justice Department because No More Deaths had distributed a video showing Border Patrol agents destroying jugs of water that the group had placed in the desert. Mr. Warren was arrested a few hours after the video was posted online. A spokesman for Customs and Border Protection, Robert Daniels, said the agency could not comment during the pending prosecution.
That is certainly one way to look at it, not the Christian way but a way.
Another way to look at Warren's acts - if he puts out water and food (also littering) - to encourage illegal migration, and puts more innocent people at risk as they expect to find water and food to help them; He is not acting as a Good Samaritan. He is encouraging illegal migration through a risky desert landscape and putting more innocent people at risk. Originally Posted by oeb11
- eccielover
- 06-12-2019, 05:03 PM
- WTF
- 06-12-2019, 05:13 PM
- friendly fred
- 06-12-2019, 05:18 PM
I agree with you.You just want cheap and desperate employees to exploit in your business.
Stupid waste of taxpayer dollars.
The policy before was suffice. Jeff Session was probably trying g to get back in Trumps good grace with this bonehead policy shift. Originally Posted by WTF
We should not entice people to cross that dangerous desert.