Okay, so I am majoring in the law/criminal justice field and to be honest, I've had a super hard time finding anything about what cops CAN NOT do when trying to get a bust.
They can get naked now, they can have drugs in the room, they can use alcohol, I mean, is there anything they can't do?!
Is there anything that should be a red flag when you meet them? Aside from using sex and dollar amounts in the same sentence.
I know when I graduate I won't be doing this anymore, but I need to be careful on the way there.
Is there anything us providers can do to have our clients show they aren't cops upon arrival that LE can not do?
Just curious, because even with my major, I still can't find certain laws and rules on these scenarios and I was wondering if anyone knew anything about it.
One thing I thought about was "entrapment," but I don't think it counts in these circumstances, but I was wondering if you actually asked and they said no but turned out to be a cop, can that mean anything?
Sorry, I'm just so surprised at how little I can find even after reading so many books-- Kinda crazy.
- KierstanStarr
- 12-10-2013, 09:14 AM
- cinderbella
- 12-10-2013, 10:17 AM
Yes, I understand your sentiment and I am as concerned about this as well. Legally, it makes no sense because it defies logic. I believe it stands due to a lack of "entrapment" law in Texas and similar minded states. I also believe it has roots in the powerful jail system lobby and it's ties to legal defense, bail bondsmen and the like.
Historically, large cities in Texas such as Dallas initially attempted to provide known areas and locales (other states as well) where prostitutes and customers could hold trade and it was for the most part legal. Unfortunately, just like today there were too many "moral majority" zealots who complained and campaigned enough to force the hand of lawmakers into closing such activity down.
Today in the U.S. we grapple with the notion that whoever commits a crime is to be punished excessively and in effect, be stripped of their basic human rights such as a criminal record and even so much as identified on a credit report as a form of lasting punishment meant to instill fear and a negative stereotype cast that haunts the person forever, forget about redemption and renewal.
I have traveled extensively overseas and have read and watched everything I can find on this subject of law and consequence. Many nations are trying to adapt laws and conditions geared toward decriminalization and rehabilitation. When human beings are at their most vulnerable and angst ridden state, psychologically building someone up and encouraging them to make better choices and lastly, giving them the fundamental tools and conditions to better themselves and contribute positively to society benefits and strengthens a society as a whole.
Personally, I believe the United States is too large and populated to instill "one size fits all" law and order. If I did not have ties here to family and such, I would choose to leave and find a country where I could be accepted and appreciated for the mainly law abiding, tax paying contributing member of society that I am.
Many lawmakers are guided by extremist viewpoints held in their gerrymandered districts and the overwhelming power of the jail lobbyists who do not want everyone to have basic human rights. By making a basically misdemeanor crime such a priority, this further pushes the black market and makes it far easier for the sickest and the most dangerous aspects to operate, the pimps and the human slave racketeers. The desire for sex and companionship is as old as mankind itself. Police justify this lack of entrapment law as a green light to utilize to their advantage. It's relatively easy and extremely profitable. It's a never ending cycle and feeds off it's own unscrupulous ethics to justify it's actions and generates big bucks for itself in the process. In other words, it is illogical and it's simply taking advantage of the easiest targets.
Historically, large cities in Texas such as Dallas initially attempted to provide known areas and locales (other states as well) where prostitutes and customers could hold trade and it was for the most part legal. Unfortunately, just like today there were too many "moral majority" zealots who complained and campaigned enough to force the hand of lawmakers into closing such activity down.
Today in the U.S. we grapple with the notion that whoever commits a crime is to be punished excessively and in effect, be stripped of their basic human rights such as a criminal record and even so much as identified on a credit report as a form of lasting punishment meant to instill fear and a negative stereotype cast that haunts the person forever, forget about redemption and renewal.
I have traveled extensively overseas and have read and watched everything I can find on this subject of law and consequence. Many nations are trying to adapt laws and conditions geared toward decriminalization and rehabilitation. When human beings are at their most vulnerable and angst ridden state, psychologically building someone up and encouraging them to make better choices and lastly, giving them the fundamental tools and conditions to better themselves and contribute positively to society benefits and strengthens a society as a whole.
Personally, I believe the United States is too large and populated to instill "one size fits all" law and order. If I did not have ties here to family and such, I would choose to leave and find a country where I could be accepted and appreciated for the mainly law abiding, tax paying contributing member of society that I am.
Many lawmakers are guided by extremist viewpoints held in their gerrymandered districts and the overwhelming power of the jail lobbyists who do not want everyone to have basic human rights. By making a basically misdemeanor crime such a priority, this further pushes the black market and makes it far easier for the sickest and the most dangerous aspects to operate, the pimps and the human slave racketeers. The desire for sex and companionship is as old as mankind itself. Police justify this lack of entrapment law as a green light to utilize to their advantage. It's relatively easy and extremely profitable. It's a never ending cycle and feeds off it's own unscrupulous ethics to justify it's actions and generates big bucks for itself in the process. In other words, it is illogical and it's simply taking advantage of the easiest targets.
- Pistolero
- 12-10-2013, 10:49 AM
Just an off topic comment. If you are going into the business later, you really should not be posting face pictures on your hooker ads. That is likely to come back at you later.
- KierstanStarr
- 12-10-2013, 11:11 AM
Thanks Pistolero. I want to be a defense attorney for people like you and me, so quite honestly, if my clients ever found out about it, they may think I can fight it better. I think I'll be alright, thanks though. I'm not going into politics. Just the law field.
PS- Yes, there's also the chance they won't like it but at least I'll know what I can and can't say to win a case in court. I'll also know more about the market, which might help me find loopholes.
PS- Yes, there's also the chance they won't like it but at least I'll know what I can and can't say to win a case in court. I'll also know more about the market, which might help me find loopholes.
- Guest062114-5
- 12-10-2013, 11:34 AM
Thanks Pistolero. I want to be a defense attorney for people like you and me, so quite honestly, if my clients ever found out about it, they may think I can fight it better. I think I'll be alright, thanks though. I'm not going into politics. Just the law field.Good for you. When applying to law schools, strongly consider Tulane. I know several exstrippers who graduated from there. They also have the Journal of Law & Sexuality. PM me for more info if you like.
PS- Yes, there's also the chance they won't like it but at least I'll know what I can and can't say to win a case in court. I'll also know more about the market, which might help me find loopholes. Originally Posted by KierstanStarr
My best advice on your original question is this:
Screen and only see guys that seem trustworthy. Spend time chatting with them before hand...just chit chat, not business related. Nothing about $. If possible, meet for a drink before when meeting a first time client. This improves the GFE experience and cops will likely not target a girl who doesn't discuss details and wants to be social first.
Consider doing dinner dates at a really good rate. Cops aren't sitting through dinner to bust you unless you're part of a huge UC sting.
I will PM you my final and most important suggestion.
Good luck with your studies. I'd be happy to meet up and discuss.
- oliviatwxxted
- 12-11-2013, 05:15 AM
I often wonder why this question keeps coming up and its bc you are not screening properly. I know girls who did this for 10 years at the higher end and never once got busted. It is important to know the law and procon.org lists by state what the consequences are.
Remember they are paying for your time and that is perfectly legal.
Remember they are paying for your time and that is perfectly legal.
- ElisabethWhispers
- 12-11-2013, 04:40 PM
Thanks Pistolero. I want to be a defense attorney for people like you and me, so quite honestly, if my clients ever found out about it, they may think I can fight it better. I think I'll be alright, thanks though. I'm not going into politics. Just the law field. Originally Posted by KierstanStarrI had a friend kicked out of medical school when she got caught doing massages without a license. I would imagine that there are morality type of clauses for those going to law school.
Unless you're going to be a self-employed lawyer when you get out of school, I would heed that advice that Pistolero suggested. It was sage.
Protect your identity all that you can. Even if you're not going to end up in law school, there are other things you might like to do when you get older.
Don't let this world come back and bite you. Trust me, life (and society) can be horribly unforgiving when you least expect it.
As far as your topic goes, entrapment is what they just do. I don't know of anything they cannot do to entrap. In the long run, it doesn't matter.
What matters is keeping yourself safe and out of trouble.
Best,
Elisabeth
- ElisabethWhispers
- 12-11-2013, 04:44 PM
- Guest062114-5
- 12-11-2013, 05:06 PM
I wouldn't mind knowing that most important suggestion myself. I'm very open to learning new things.Ill drop you a note in a bit.Originally Posted by ElisabethWhispers
Most secular law schools don't have a morality clause but you may be asked about commiting criminal acts on the Bar App and school apps. Since you are only charging for companionship, technically, you would not have to divulge your life as an escort. But if discovered, it could be enough to require you answer more questions or even have a Character and Fitness Hearing.
It isn't about the morality. It's about the law. And yes, performing massages without a license is also illegal. And performing a licensed massage while nude...another No No. That's why you should only call them body rubs.
Additionally, it is VERY difficult to pop out if law school and "hang your own shingle" and make enough money to survive. Most lawyers I ask say it took 5-10 years to make it on their own. Even then most make about $100k. If that.
An easier path is to work at an Assistant DA, for the Attorney General, or if your area has one, Althea Public Defenders office. Do that for three years and you'll be ahead of game in terms of trial experience. BUT, having your photo all over the Internet on hooker sites might keep you from getting one of those jobs. Or worse yet, leave you open as a target.
- jframe2
- 12-15-2013, 07:07 AM
Without knowing what State Bar(s) you plan on passing, I imagine there are "Morals" clauses that will apply to your license.
I believe this clause could be applied to any actions (current or past) that can be proven to the State licensing board.
And I would presume a face picture with your ad would definitely be a problem for you. Whether the ad was current or from years past would not matter to the license board.
You might do some general web-news article searches to see if any similar situations are out there.
I recall somewhere that licensing-action was brought up against a woman (several years after she began practicing) based on the fact that she worked as a "bikini-stripper" while attending law school.
I believe she posed for print ads for the business and these ads made their way to the State Board. While certainly embarrassing for her, I believe the outcome was in her favor because "bikini-stripping" was legal in that state.
Just saying.....
I believe this clause could be applied to any actions (current or past) that can be proven to the State licensing board.
And I would presume a face picture with your ad would definitely be a problem for you. Whether the ad was current or from years past would not matter to the license board.
You might do some general web-news article searches to see if any similar situations are out there.
I recall somewhere that licensing-action was brought up against a woman (several years after she began practicing) based on the fact that she worked as a "bikini-stripper" while attending law school.
I believe she posed for print ads for the business and these ads made their way to the State Board. While certainly embarrassing for her, I believe the outcome was in her favor because "bikini-stripping" was legal in that state.
Just saying.....
Thanks Pistolero. I want to be a defense attorney for people like you and me, so quite honestly, if my clients ever found out about it, they may think I can fight it better. I think I'll be alright, thanks though. I'm not going into politics. Just the law field.
PS- Yes, there's also the chance they won't like it but at least I'll know what I can and can't say to win a case in court. I'll also know more about the market, which might help me find loopholes. Originally Posted by KierstanStarr
- Guest062114-5
- 12-15-2013, 07:31 AM
Without knowing what State Bar(s) you plan on passing, I imagine there are "Morals" clauses that will apply to your license.If you come across that particular case, I'd love to see it. My gut felling is there would have had to be more to that situation besides some "bikini stripper" pics. In my opinion, all of the law student and lawyers who go on some of those ridiculous reality shows are far worse "character and fitness-wise" than a stripper of any kind.
I believe this clause could be applied to any actions (current or past) that can be proven to the State licensing board.
And I would presume a face picture with your ad would definitely be a problem for you. Whether the ad was current or from years past would not matter to the license board.
You might do some general web-news article searches to see if any similar situations are out there.
I recall somewhere that licensing-action was brought up against a woman (several years after she began practicing) based on the fact that she worked as a "bikini-stripper" while attending law school.
I believe she posed for print ads for the business and these ads made their way to the State Board. While certainly embarrassing for her, I believe the outcome was in her favor because "bikini-stripping" was legal in that state.
Just saying..... Originally Posted by jframe2
Some Bar Apps do require disclosing any employment going back a certain number of years, I guess that's a way they could get you. However, since most strippers are independent contractors, a vague reference to self-employment should cover it.
- 19Trees
- 12-15-2013, 11:09 AM
Oops, looks like they CAN
http://www.abc2news.com/dpp/news/cri...an-trafficking
http://bossip.com/876875/protect-and...e-girls-video/
In this photo, the guy's facial injuries occurred after the arrest while in police custody...
http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/...ts_out_to.html
Here was NYC cop charged for Attempted Rape on a just turned 16 year old girl who "came on to me" according to the offending officer.
http://www.silive.com/news/index.ssf...sland_cop.html
For every cop charged with rape, there are estimated 20 others that have not been reported. Being "off duty" at the time of the rape should not be a defense, lest they try:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/20/ny...rape.html?_r=0
More charming cop behavior here, selling minors into prostitution so the cop gets 20 dollars (of the client funds) per "pop" ...
http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/b...ituted-minors/
Then of course are the Blue House Cops... 17 charges of conspiracy to commit kidnapping; kidnapping; conspiracy to commit felonious restraint; conspiracy to compel prostitution; compelling prostitution; conspiracy to promote prostitution; promoting prostitution; first-degree criminal sexual conduct; second-degree criminal sexual conduct; attempted first-degree criminal sexual conduct; attempted second-degree criminal sexual conduct; criminal intimidation; and official misconduct....
http://mvguam.com/local/news/30840-t...ouse-cops.html
----------------
More Charming Links on What Cops Can't Do (oops they can):
http://www.oregonlive.com/beaverton/...e_on_duty.html
http://www.phillyburbs.com/my_town/b....html?mode=jqm
http://www.app.com/article/20131017/NJNEWS14/310170062/
http://advanceindiana.blogspot.com/2...ers-still.html
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...titution-ring/
--------------------------------------
As to the OP's question what cops CAN'T do? Seems NOTHING is the best answer?
19Trees
http://www.abc2news.com/dpp/news/cri...an-trafficking
http://bossip.com/876875/protect-and...e-girls-video/
In this photo, the guy's facial injuries occurred after the arrest while in police custody...
http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/...ts_out_to.html
Here was NYC cop charged for Attempted Rape on a just turned 16 year old girl who "came on to me" according to the offending officer.
http://www.silive.com/news/index.ssf...sland_cop.html
For every cop charged with rape, there are estimated 20 others that have not been reported. Being "off duty" at the time of the rape should not be a defense, lest they try:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/20/ny...rape.html?_r=0
More charming cop behavior here, selling minors into prostitution so the cop gets 20 dollars (of the client funds) per "pop" ...
http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/b...ituted-minors/
Then of course are the Blue House Cops... 17 charges of conspiracy to commit kidnapping; kidnapping; conspiracy to commit felonious restraint; conspiracy to compel prostitution; compelling prostitution; conspiracy to promote prostitution; promoting prostitution; first-degree criminal sexual conduct; second-degree criminal sexual conduct; attempted first-degree criminal sexual conduct; attempted second-degree criminal sexual conduct; criminal intimidation; and official misconduct....
http://mvguam.com/local/news/30840-t...ouse-cops.html
----------------
More Charming Links on What Cops Can't Do (oops they can):
http://www.oregonlive.com/beaverton/...e_on_duty.html
http://www.phillyburbs.com/my_town/b....html?mode=jqm
http://www.app.com/article/20131017/NJNEWS14/310170062/
http://advanceindiana.blogspot.com/2...ers-still.html
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...titution-ring/
--------------------------------------
As to the OP's question what cops CAN'T do? Seems NOTHING is the best answer?
19Trees
- Chocolate Kayla
- 01-01-2014, 01:19 AM
i always thought they couldn;t touch you is that correct??
- Guest062114-5
- 01-01-2014, 01:57 AM
- 19Trees
- 01-01-2014, 12:08 PM
http://www.iswface.org/images/Top-Te...ing-set-up.jpg
http://www.cape-dc.com/Avoiding_Entrapment.html
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documen...ion-sex-769812
http://www.polklawblog.com/archives/...ff-no-touching
http://on.aol.com/video/cop-has-sex-...ief--517982418
http://www.katu.com/news/local/OSP-d...218720321.html
http://www.kptv.com/story/23074391/o...rvaez-arrested
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gn4tBwn-_a8
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3015154.html
Hope the links above are helpful. Some of video shows cops fucking the providers in (and on) their patrol cars, even in the holding pen at the lockup.
19Trees
http://www.cape-dc.com/Avoiding_Entrapment.html
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documen...ion-sex-769812
http://www.polklawblog.com/archives/...ff-no-touching
http://on.aol.com/video/cop-has-sex-...ief--517982418
http://www.katu.com/news/local/OSP-d...218720321.html
http://www.kptv.com/story/23074391/o...rvaez-arrested
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gn4tBwn-_a8
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3015154.html
Hope the links above are helpful. Some of video shows cops fucking the providers in (and on) their patrol cars, even in the holding pen at the lockup.
19Trees