"VICE" The saying in the under world is, "One Vice, feeds another", do you find that to be true????

Prostitution is said to be the worlds oldest profession, during the great depression it was said a man would buy pussy before cotton or corn. As hobbiest do you control the hobby, or does the hobby control you ?? Prostitution is one of several vices organized crime has used to make money for years along with gambling, drug dealing, and bootlegging anything society calls illegal but easily sold. Once a player is hooker into the vice of their choice, then the mob makes the player a slave for life to the vice of their choice. Many hobbiest use the term "think with your big head", which in many cases is easier said than done. On the flip side once the client is out the door, is the provider on the phone trying to score drugs or pay for her vice. Lifestyle or the Image of a certain standard of living seems to be a major issue with many providers, this seems would fall into PRIDE, which we all know many of us will pay what ever it takes to maintain our pride/image. So the question goes all around do you own the VICE, or does the VICE own you ????

Prostitution is said to be the worlds oldest profession, during the great depression it was said a man would buy pussy before cotton or corn. As hobbiest do you control the hobby, or does the hobby control you ?? Prostitution is one of several vices organized crime has used to make money for years along with gambling, drug dealing, and bootlegging anything society calls illegal but easily sold. Once a player is hooker into the vice of their choice, then the mob makes the player a slave for life to the vice of their choice. Many hobbiest use the term "think with your big head", which in many cases is easier said than done. On the flip side once the client is out the door, is the provider on the phone trying to score drugs or pay for her vice. Lifestyle or the Image of a certain standard of living seems to be a major issue with many providers, this seems would fall into PRIDE, which we all know many of us will pay what ever it takes to maintain our pride/image. So the question goes all around do you own the VICE, or does the VICE own you ???? Originally Posted by "SLICKBACK"

Very good topic. Personally I don't partake in any sexual acts outside of this that would be considered out of the norm. I mean I do anal and cim with someone I am dating, but I don't visit swinger's clubs, bring strangers home to bed for us, etc. I still believe when you marry someone that you should be faithful unless of course you both decide you want an open relationship. I still belive in God, raise my child in a Christian environment, don't bring men around her unless we are serious, and even then they don't spend the night etc.

I won't live with a guy before I am married either but it's more than just one reason. This is the one part of my life that does not line up with everything else I believe and practice, and if money was not involved I would not be here. I don't believe in casual sex without intimacy. Sure I have done a few one night stands when I was younger, but I have no interest in that now.

Most people I meet in this business are anything goes all the time, and it's very rare to meet like minded people who believe that just because one thing in your life might not be acceptable does not mean you have to jump in to every part of it. I am not motivated by lust, greed, self gratification etc. so if I were to lose this income the only ones who would suffer would be my parents, since I take care of them. I would not miss the profession or even think about it if I were in love.

Sex is a sport, its a pastime.. most people play baseball for fun, some play it for a living or as an occupation. Most girls have sex for fun, but some do it for a living. I think the one thing that we as humans do is to delve too deep into this sport with hard thinking, If your friend says hey wanna go play a round of golf, you say sure bob lets go, well why shouldnt it be the same for the sport of sex?

Is it a vice? maybe, if you consider Golf or Football a a vice for you, then sure, sport sex is a vice then. I think we have spent so much time going against our own nature, that we start to think that ANYTHING we do for fun is wrong, hell cant smoke, cant drink, cant do a damn thing because its all wrong or bad or unhealthy, ok so lets all live a boring, robotic, and unified crap ass life, or we can say to hell with that! I want to ENJOY my life, i want to Play my sport of choice, and enjoy what i enjoy, and everyone who dooesnt like it can pucker up and kiss my ass!

But to do that we have to also be willing to Live and let live, you cant rage against the "machine", and then critisize others who rage against the same machine in their own way, that makes you the same as all those telling YOU whats right or wrong. If you are going to go against the grain, then let others do it as well, having your cake and eating it too maybe be the america way, but so is the middle finger,lol.

Vice? sure, but lifes a vice, you want your life, you will do anything to keep your life, and in the end, you always lose the battle. Why overthink it, just go get laid and hope you get away with it... Welcome to the Human Race.

I own the vice - if it is even truly a vice. Never let it own you - or you're in deep shit.

Vice, Smice........Muff, when u bringing some new girls down? Thats the only question I care about.

The key point I am trying to make with this, is not is gambling, drugs, self indulgence, prostitution etc. wrong, in my opinion people make their own choices in life and the end consequence is the ultimate price we pay, or possibly we hurt or drag others down when we let our choices get the best of us, the key point is do you have control or have you lost control of what ever is your vice or hobby??? ex. Say Sussie X, is going to college to be a nurse, and is struggling financially, a friend suggests she may want to become a escort to help pay her expenses until she finishes school, sounds great so she goes with it, 3 years later she finishes her nursing school, and now she is ready to make her living being a nurse, six months or so into her new career, she can not seem to make ends meet, so she decides to go back to escorting to pay the bills until she catches up financially, then she will quit for good. One year later she meets the guy of her dreams, she is no longer escorting, and things are looking great, they set the date for the wedding and make the plans, she wants a big wedding, and does not have a family with the financial background to pay all the cost, so on the sly, hoping beyond hope her ever beloved does not find out she plans on escorting on the side just enough to raise the money to help pay for her wedding then she will quit for good. In this example, she is obviously compromising what she feels is her personal values, but for a price and the revenues it generates she is willing to take one more chance. Dose she control the vice, or has the vice now gained control of her.

If I TRULY loved him, no way I would do that. The problem is that today's definition of love has been so twisted to meet the individual, it has lost all value. "I love my wife but I cheat on her." " I love my children but I use their lunch money to buy crack." People tend to rationalize what they do to feel better about it. Not me...I know what I am doing is wrong morally, but right now I feel I would rather do the suffering than anyone in my family. It is still wrong, but I do it anyway. See no fluff here

For any person to go from a few grand a week, lap of luxury life, to an average 9-5 and 2 weeks vacation a year life, would be diffficult. Add to that the drive that first put them into the business whatever it might have been. Bottom line, its hard to find satisfaction in another lifestyle and occupation, certainly some girls change their life marry and never look back, but that may be 1 out of 100.

What Clients dont know are the true lives of these girls, what made them decide "yea, i can do that job" and keep doing it, they wont tell you that "oh well i was sleeping around alot and figure i might as well get paid" or "its an easy way to pay for my drugs" but lets face it, many of them do it for those reasons. You might call it a vice, but for many girls in this industry, its simply a way of chosen life to get what they want as fast and as easy as possible. The only problem for many of them, the lifestyle they chose, takes much of the income they earn, and in the end, after a few years they are just as broke as when they began, and have alot more notches on the bedpost.

All of the girls i have ever worked with will tell you, I push for them to save and invest in a future so that doing this has a meaning and value down the road, those i dont see taking advantage of those ideals, i have chosen to no longer manage, If a girl arrives and i notice that shes taking every last dime and sending it to some loser bf who doesnt work and hes buying rims for his car, that girl isnt going to get anywhere and i cannot help her, id rather give the spot to someone who will make better use of it. Is it my place to tell them what to do with their money? Nope, but if they do the wrong thing, all i would be doing is enabling some loser bf to use a young girl take what shes got and leave her spent, used and betrayed, and thats not a trip im willing to take. Thats why you wont find any Elves who do drugs, drink excessively, or have a "gimme the money and go" attitude. What you will find is a happy girl, who is greatful to each and every client for making their lives better.

This lifestyle and occupation isnt a Vice, its a Choice that begins many choices, the question is, can those involved make enough good choices to change their life for the better, or will they make too many bad choices to ever get beyond being just another "Long Term Provider". If you have been escorting for 7 or 8 years, and your still doing it, either you really love sex, or you have made very shitty investments and choices.

If you want to know what the future is... Look at your past and change nothing.

If you want to know what the future is... Look at your past and change nothing. Originally Posted by MuffDVR

I really like that It's true what you say about investing. If all you do is spend every dime you make here, you are never going to get out. Never paid a car note, own real estate which generates income, and wisely invest...all good suggestions.

Human behavior has always interested me, the why we become what we are, is there a pre planed destiny for us, out of a family of 4 why does 3 turn out to be doctors and lawyers and 1 a convicted drug dealer in prison??? Life is not fair, because the world we are born in is not fair, but we can help create our own opportunities successfully or as a failure. Personnally I grew up around the adult entertainment business from many different angles. Associates of mine had interests in prostitution, strip clubs, under ground porn studios anything you can think of. On the back drop many of the same people that ran these outfits were sitting in catholic church every sunday (not saying anything bad about catholics), just making the point that while these people ran for the most part the adult entertainment industry locally, they posed as upstanding church going citizens, and that is all right, because that is who they were, every person has to live at some point with who they are, they have to look in the mirror and accept what they see. They can show society what ever they want people to see but they can not lie to themselves, and the biggest thing that hurts people in most cases is reality and the truth of who and what they are.

Thanks for an interesting topic Slickback. One that I have thought about from time to time. With valid statements, opinions and probably the best DISCUSSION that Kaylee and MuffDVR have ever contributed to. Thanks to both of them for the insights and Well said to you both.

Just curious and not trying to stir trouble, but are you writing an article? Seriously, the questions your asking are very similar to those a psychologist or sociologist would ask.

Interesting topics...Ill give you that, I just prefer not to be analyzed or dig in too deep in public but if you ever want to talk in private Ill tell ya some stuff. I met someone like you before and the whole session he asked these same questions--while I had him tied up and in a vulnerable state. So I put on a good show for him, love to psych out a psych!

And I do like Kaylee and Muffys replies....very sincere and very real. I think the provider stereotype is that they use the money for vices, ie: drugs, booze, etc. but most of the providers I know are very successful, have money in the bank, are educated and live comfortably. But there is an emotional price to pay, especially when you try to exit the biz. I know, Im going thru it, Ive not been "on hands" in a very long time and considering a return.

My vice....MONEY! I always want more of it! How do I spend it? I dont! I just want it just in case. Im always broke even when Im not broke. And the more requests I get from my guys lately the more Im tempted to return...but these are also men that I like as well, and I miss the attention they gave me. So another vice is Im an attention whore, so shoot me! LMAO.

Here is my understanding of a "vice." Anything is okay in life if one can do it in moderation. The term moderation is relative, meaning what is moderate for me is different for what is moderate for another. For example if I bite my nails occassionally only when extremely nervous and do not bite them to the core, in my mind thats okay. Now, if someone were to bite his nails continuously to the core where little to no nail is left, then it becomes harmful to the individual and that is abuse. The problem with addiction is that the individual participates in his or her vice until it becomes harmful to others or themselves. A drug addict spends time turning tricks to get her fix and does not invest and does not shower all efforts are spent on obtaining her fix. That is harmful to herself and her family, who has to watch her destroy herself. That is abuse.

So, does anyone ever own their addiction? I do not know the answer to that. I try to keep balance in my life, moderation in everything I do. Do I sometimes go overboard? Absoutely I am human, but I usually regret it later on.

The orginal scenario if I understand correctly, has the lady seeing hobbyists as the "vice" in order to satisfy her addiction, the substances. The addiction of drugs would seem to own her as she is doing something she considers immoral to obtain her fix, hence it is harmful to her. For me, i do not think the hobby is immoral in any least bit and really feel it should be legal. What two participating adults chose to do in private is none of my business and if they chose to pay or get paid what do I care? And should not a crime harm someone? Who is harmed by prostitution? So, for me the hobby is not immoral, it is fun and supports the local economy. Sometimes I even support out of state economies, lol.

Outdoorsman, keep it up, and you will be my VICE!

I go overboard on a few things in my life, dont we all. But the cold hard truth again...not all providers are so lucky as the ones who are here and have it together. I think some of his answers he will find to be disturbing if he were to ask those under the control of a street pimp, human trafficker, or homeless prostitute working the street corner. The beautiful ladies here are running their business successfully through advertising, networking and so on. So I seriously doubt you would find any of them having any major vices they are supporting, unless they are pretty good at hiding it. I also dont think anyone would openly admit to having a vice on here that may have a negative effect on her business or on his part...being seen by a provider. Some things are very personal.

As far as the men, its obvious what their vice is...SEX! If it werent, the hobby wouldnt exist.

...I won't live with a guy before I am married either but it's more than just one reason... Originally Posted by Kaylee

This is a good policy (for an important practical reason) and I'm surprised so many young women don't get it.

When a girl moves in with her boyfriend, she's able to increase her material lifestyle either by not needing to pay rent at all or by having him to share in paying it. Sounds good on the surface. But, she's just made the maintenance of her lifestyle dependent on his satisfaction with the relationship. If she's not named on the lease or mortgage, she doesn't even have any of the rights of a tenant concerning notice before eviction. The end of the relationship means a reduction (sometimes severe) in lifestyle. At least in living alone or named in the lease with her roommate/s, loss of the relationship won't change the lifestyle and in marriage there's some financial recourse which scares a lot of us men into staying single.