Do you Get What You Pay For? What Are You Paying For?

Lately, I've been scoping a lot of different cities, looking in a direction to start touring. & I've come across a few I know I'd never go to, some that look like awesome, brand new hobbyist cities & then, something caught my eye.

In some cities, most of the "providers" are marketed all around the same price. Some of them provide any & everything, fetishes, greek, CIM, etc. etc, some don't.. others have great pictures & websites, others don't. BUT, they are all, if not mostly priced within the same range.

Q:80 * HH:100 * HR:150 : These are estimated averages.

I know my rates & I've seen a few others.. If I may, I'd like to ask a few questions:

1. What are you guys paying for? (ex. Great service when you get there.. or the pretty pictures you look at before you see the real deal?)

2. Does the provider need to be all-inclusive for you to break a budget?

3. What makes you spend the money that you spend THAT DAY, where you spend it?

4. Have you ever settled for more of what you didn't want, because you couldn't afford what you actually did?

5. Has there ever been a time when you wanted to see someone & didn't because of their location? (ex. HH donation = $150, incall -- Motel on South Congress) *my example was pretty far fetched, from what I've seen, but that's why it's an example*

Obviously, I set my own rates (as we all do) & personally, at times I feel like they're a bit too high. But if I lower my prices to that of a SW shouldn't I just be one? Let me clarify, because re-reading that might lead a few of you ladies (who's rates are in that range) to think that I was referring to YOU as a streetwalker, which in any case, unless that's what you're doing, you'd know I'm just talking & trying to verbalize my point, here in this thread.

To further explain, I've lowered my rates before, lower than those in my example, in the advice of a highly respected regular client & I couldn't believe the amount of calls that poured in.. but you know what, more than half of them I didnt, wouldn't, couldn't or knew I shouldn't see. PsychoNewbs, after hour late night callers, lurkers, obscene talkers, bargin hunters, negotiators, just.. men with complete & total disregard for my life as a human & the way to speak to a normal person, because of what you think my profession happens to be? I didn't like that.. & once I raised my numbers back up, I stopped getting those superfluous, obnoxious calls.

I don't want to attract creepy, obscene talking, bargain negotiators, but I also don't want guys who want to see me to not ever be able to because of my "high" rate.

With all of that being said, if your everyday, around the way, pretty girl next door decided to become a provider, without a website, a professional photo album, without all inclusive, without all the extra curricular activities basically, without knowing what she'd actually provide -- if we all shared the same rate, regardless of what we actually did or didn't do, IN TEXAS, IN TEXAS & again, IN TEXAS - What's the base flat rates we'd all have, if you had the say so?

So, yes, in your prefect world, your ATF, the BP girls, ECCIE verified providers, international escorts & the SW would all advertise using the same rates THATS WHAT I WANT TO KNOW. What would those flat rates be?

Since that'd be heaven for most of you & I'm all about catering to the man, I want to see if my rates & I can come to a silent compromise.

& maybe this thread will help someone else do the same thing, too.

"I have talked with some girls that are on BP and P411/ECCIE/etc. and they have made comments about the the lesser quality guys that they get through BP/CL. I have noticed a lot of the P411/ECCIE girls coming from other areas do use BP more than the local P411/ECCIE girls."

(From user Jake2.1 posted in another thread, thought it fit perfect here.)

Different markets have different protocols and different rate structures. If a lady goes into a $200 market where the ladies differ only in what they do rather in how much they charge for it, and she tries to charge $350 for cbj's and LFK, why does she feel the problem lies with the hobbyists?

If a lady who looks like a Playboy model goes into an area where the average lady is 30 pounds overweight, she will command a premium price but at the same time will limit herself to those who can afford her. Then on the second trip thru, if she didn't perform on the first trip, she'll sit in the room alone and complain about the hobbyists, won't she?

um, what?

everything you said is what i already know. and, im not complaining about hobbyists. im complaining about my own damn rate and how i can somehow please the hobbyists without completely lowering myself & my rates. thanks.

In some cities, most of the "providers" are marketed all around the same price. Some of them provide any & everything, fetishes, greek, CIM, etc. etc, some don't.. others have great pictures & websites, others don't. BUT, they are all, if not mostly priced within the same range.

Q:80 * HH:100 * HR:150 : These are estimated averages.
Originally Posted by DianaDeepthroats

What city is this ???

I may move there!

(just kidding ... kind of)

I think the basic challenge in your question is that providers don't set rates, the market sets rates. Each provider along with the services they provide, experience they provide and the volume they want to achieve will end up at a rate that is right for a given market. In Texas the basic market is $200 but every provider at that rate given their service offering (the combination of service and looks, chemistry etc.), city, supply and demand and a multitude of other factors will have a completely different level of volume.

With trial and error, you can find the equilibrium of your desired volume and the quality of your clientele by either adjusting your rate or service. But to assume that one rate will work for all levels of service doesn't work. It may look like the rates are all about the same but from the hobbyists perspective there are very good reasons why a provider with a whole suitcase full of services gets the same rate as someone with just a limited few. Generally, do the research find the provider that provides a similar experience as yours in a given market, find out what they charge and start there. You may have to adjust your service or your price to get the right kind of volume.

1. What are you guys paying for? (ex. Great service when you get there.. or the pretty pictures you look at before you see the real deal?) I'm paying for the complete package. Trust me, I do tremendous amount of research on providers that I want to see. I'm probably obsessively compulsive in this research. Plus, I also try to converse with the provider in advance of our date. That way when I walk through the door, I'm pretty damn sure of how things will go and the level of service I'll receive.

2. Does the provider need to be all-inclusive for you to break a budget? Yes and no. Unless the provider is going to the date of a lifetime, I've already researched the services and price structure of the provider(s) I want to see. My selection process pretty much goes like this: 1) I'm attracted to the provider 2) Does she offer the services I want to engage in 3) Does her price structure fit my budget. If I can be relatively confident all 3 criteria have been met, I'll try to set up a date. Of course, I may have to compromise a little one way or another, but I have to comfortable within my given criteria. It goes back to research and some semblance of self-discipline. Again, once a date has been confirmed, I'm pretty comfortable in knowing the results of the date-- quality provider, valued service, fun for all.

3. What makes you spend the money that you spend THAT DAY, where you spend it? Attractive provider who offers services that I want to partake in at a reasonable donation rate.

4. Have you ever settled for more of what you didn't want, because you couldn't afford what you actually did? Yes, and I regretted it. Gotta remain disciplined and remember that the bigger head does the thinking-- not the little head.

5. Has there ever been a time when you wanted to see someone & didn't because of their location? (ex. HH donation = $150, incall -- Motel on South Congress) *my example was pretty far fetched, from what I've seen, but that's why it's an example* No because in that given scenario my research would have said stay away.

As to your dilemma over lowering prices, my advice as a hobbyist is don't. You point out several valid reasons on why not, but I put another spin on things. As a hobbyist, I question providers who have low rates. That tells me high volume. Do I really want to be the 4th guy she's been with that day? No. The key is how you market yourself. Instead of being Wal-Mart, be Target or Macys, but don't be Bloomingdales. Find that middle ground. Trust me, the hobbyists who do research know who to stay clear of and who to contact about a date. One thing to consider (esp for touring), try unpublished specials for hobbyists you've seen in the past in a particular location. Give these guys a heads up that you will be in their area and offer them a $50-$100 discount if they pre-book. At the same time, do the normal advertising with your normal rates. That way you may get some repeat business while at the same time finding new clients. Trust me if a provider I had seen before gave me a repeat customer discount, I'd go for it.

I know my rates & I've seen a few others.. If I may, I'd like to ask a few questions:

1. What are you guys paying for? (ex. Great service when you get there.. or the pretty pictures you look at before you see the real deal?)

2. Does the provider need to be all-inclusive for you to break a budget?

3. What makes you spend the money that you spend THAT DAY, where you spend it?

4. Have you ever settled for more of what you didn't want, because you couldn't afford what you actually did?

5. Has there ever been a time when you wanted to see someone & didn't because of their location? (ex. HH donation = $150, incall -- Motel on South Congress) *my example was pretty far fetched, from what I've seen, but that's why it's an example* Originally Posted by DianaDeepthroats

There have been some good responses here already, and I would add my voice to the chorus saying you should set your rates at what you think your time is worth. The market I'm in is a lot less saturated than Texas, so my experience is skewed a bit, but the rates you list as average are on the low end. You already have an idea what a "too low" rate for you is based on the volume of obnoxious/unwelcome calls you got when you cut prices. What is "too high" depends on what kind of volume you want. The previously mentioned idea of unadvertised specials for repeat clients (especially those you really want to keep coming back), and especially when touring, can be good. Just be aware that some men are touchy about a provider initiating any contact, even if it's an offer of a good deal (I'm not one of them, but I know they're out there).

For your questions:

1) I'm paying for the complete experience, but for me chemistry and intangibles are more important than a specific appearance or menu. Having said that, there are certain things in those areas that are dealbreakers. Paid multiple visits to Michael Jackson's plastic surgeon? No kissing? No thanks.

2) If by all-inclusive you mean no upcharges for anything she chooses to offer, that's my preference since it avoids awkward conversations before we've met. Walking the line between letting a provider know what "package" I want and maintaining discretion can be difficult. If by all-inclusive you mean she offers everything short of BBFS, well, that's nice but see #1.

3) Multiple factors. Availability. Whether I can take the time to arrange an outcall location (some providers I see only do outcall and for logistical reasons I have to get a place). If there's a particular service I'm in the mood for that I know one provider enjoys and others don't. If my mental/emotional state at that point makes one provider's personality a better fit for me than another's. Notice I haven't mentioned price.

4) Nope. My income allows me to see all but the true HDH's without worrying too much about cost. It has sometimes turned out that what I thought I wanted really wasn't, though.

5) Sort of. I have to travel a fair distance to meet with a provider, so if one is an hour away and another is an hour and a half, I may go with the closer lady. I delayed seeing one well reviewed provider for some time because her reviews all commented on the undesirable location of her incall. I finally did take the plunge, though.

In some cities, most of the "providers" are marketed all around the same price. Some of them provide any & everything, fetishes, greek, CIM, etc. etc, some don't.. others have great pictures & websites, others don't. BUT, they are all, if not mostly priced within the same range. Originally Posted by DianaDeepthroats

I'd call that the target everyone and be mediocre at everything approach.

If I may, I'd like to ask a few questions:

1. What are you guys paying for? (ex. Great service when you get there.. or the pretty pictures you look at before you see the real deal?)

2. Does the provider need to be all-inclusive for you to break a budget?

3. What makes you spend the money that you spend THAT DAY, where you spend it?

The questions above depends on the client. I think you would be better off picking thinking about what you have and/or want toprovide and target clients who want what you're offering.

5. Has there ever been a time when you wanted to see someone & didn't because of their location? (ex. HH donation = $150, incall -- Motel on South Congress) *my example was pretty far fetched, from what I've seen, but that's why it's an example*

No. I had a list of expectations in my p411 profile that included expectations about a provider's incall. I didn't see providers whose incall was not discreet, clean, safe or was a hotel room.

I couldn't believe the amount of calls that poured in.. but you know what, more than half of them I didnt, wouldn't, couldn't or knew I shouldn't see. PsychoNewbs, after hour late night callers, lurkers, obscene talkers, bargin hunters, negotiators, just.. men with complete & total disregard for my life as a human & the way to speak to a normal person, because of what you think my profession happens to be? I didn't like that.. & once I raised my numbers back up, I stopped getting those superfluous, obnoxious calls.

I think the moral of that story is that lowering rates brings lots of calls, but not necessarily clients, much less desirable clients. On the other hand, if you want to be selective and you're rate ishigh, you don't get as many calls, so you have to deliver what you promise.

I don't want to attract creepy, obscene talking, bargain negotiators, but I also don't want guys who want to see me to not ever be able to because of my "high" rate.

With all of that being said, if your everyday, around the way, pretty girl next door decided to become a provider, without a website, a professional photo album, without all inclusive, without all the extra curricular activities basically, without knowing what she'd actually provide -- if we all shared the same rate, regardless of what we actually did or didn't do, IN TEXAS, IN TEXAS & again, IN TEXAS - What's the base flat rates we'd all have, if you had the say so?

You're making the mistake of asking what a pretty girl is worth, not what her services are worth. If you're running a business, it's not what you're worth that's relevant. It's what your services are worth. There's a big difference. Above, you've excluded everything that you could base a rate on.

So, yes, in your prefect world, your ATF, the BP girls, ECCIE verified providers, international escorts & the SW would all advertise using the same rates

Why would that be true? In a perfect world, providers would offer the services they are comfortable offering, set their rates accordingly and deliver what they promise.

5. Has there ever been a time when you wanted to see someone & didn't because of their location? (ex. HH donation = $150, incall -- Motel on South Congress) *my example was pretty far fetched, from what I've seen, but that's why it's an example* Originally Posted by DianaDeepthroats

I don't know where S. Congress is but I'm guessing it is 'da hood. I definately screen by location. I don't mind the drive across town but I'm thinking "why are you working out of da hood?"

In ATL, our major airport is basically in da hood. I've seen unknowing touring gals stay/advertise their location as "Airport." I've reached out to a few of them over the years in kind of an altrusitic/"pay it forward" kind of way that they are hurting their business by locating there.

.[/quote]

1. What are you guys paying for? (ex. Great service when you get there.. or the pretty pictures you look at before you see the real deal?) I'm paying for the complete package. Trust me, I do tremendous amount of research on providers that I want to see. I'm probably obsessively compulsive in this research.

5. Has there ever been a time when you wanted to see someone & didn't because of their location? (ex. HH donation = $150, incall -- Motel on South Congress) *my example was pretty far fetched, from what I've seen, but that's why it's an example* No because in that given scenario my research would have said stay away.
Originally Posted by Cpalmson

I've said it before but I'll say it again...cp is not the average "hobbyist"...most guy do not do a "tremendous amount of research" and are "obsessively compulsive" about it. They want a good time & a nut or two with something they find attractive. This site, its participants and its competitors' participants are a small minority in this world of our's.

As for #5...ditto...see above

I am flattered to be quoted.

As stated above, market determines rate, just like if I look at getting a job in a different city, I use a comparison site to determine the cost of living there vs where I am at currently and hopefully get compensated for that difference.

So if you run into the scenario that you have stated, then you can probably guess that those rates are that area's "standard of living". Just because it isn't as much as from where you came from, doesn't mean any less of you and your value. If it bothers you, then my suggestion is to move to a market that makes you feel ok with your rates.

Walmart prices are based on competition in the area of that particular store. I can go to different Walmarts in this same city and pay a different price for the same exact product depending on the area. (saw this on the news a couple years ago).

So, you are you. But you in one market will only get X and you in another market will get X+$ or X-$. It is still you (I assume that you are an amazing provider btw) nothing has changed but your location.

Look at it another way. The guys live in each location so they make money based on that area's standard of living. So take gas for example. 1 gallon in my city may be 2.57 but you drive 5 hrs and the same gallon is 2.62. So to the hobbyist, his dollar may be worth more or less depending on his cost of living. $.5 in one city might be the same value as $$ or even $$.5 in another.

None of this changes you.

You are still the amazing you giving the amazing service that you provide.

My guess is that the answers to your questions will be extremely similar no matter which market you get answers from. Because in one the dollar is worth more than the other but the product/service and the expectations of it are still the same.

As to you setting your rate, if you are concerned about not attracting the "bottom feeders", maybe look at what the girls on the review sites and P411 are asking vs BP. 411 girls tend to ask higher rates (my observation). Then put yourself in the competition by going between the two average rates. Or talk with a guy that seems to be established in the area for some ideas. Plus he will know if there is something going on weird as to pricing (such as in my area of the world). Just some thoughts. Unfortunately, the industry doesn't really allow guys to negotiate without repercussions from the ladies so I do understand how it could be hard to find that successful marketable value.

3. What makes you spend the money that you spend THAT DAY, where you spend it? Originally Posted by DianaDeepthroats

Unless you're treating this like a commodity service, the answer to this question is similar in some respects to the answer to "What made you decide to ask out this [civilian] lady for a date, rather than that one?"

The answer is completely different for every guy. In civilian relationships and, for many of us, in P4P. And it's not a uniform answer even for me. I have several favorite ladyfriends and, while they share several characteristics and attributes, they are also, each one, unique. And one of my favorites in part for those unique aspects.

They want a good time & a nut or two with something they find attractive. Originally Posted by atlcomedy

God... I feel so... human right now... not like an object at all.

Miss Lennox,

I am hopeful that he didn't mean it that way.

I hope I didn't come across that way either. Being a service industry, there is a lot of room for making faux pas where the service and the person get all messed up together. Especially when conversing about the business/economics of the situation.

BTW, love the photo that you use.