Obama's Foreign policy and National Security Part 2

Ok let me keep this short an simple: Saddam Hussein and Moammar Kaddafi both long time rulers and dictators- as of today both ousted and dead but let's do the math:
Saddam Huessein: The War lasted 7 years plus with 4,287 Americans dead and 30,182 and cost to tax payers: Over 1 Trillion dollars.
Moammar Kadaffi: Conflict last months- zero U.S Casualties and 1 billion tax payer dollars.
Hmmmm we can see what administration did the right thing.


To all you Right wingers who back in March said we had no business going over there and that Obama was breaking the law and Obama was leading from behind- all this after Kadaffi was on record saying he would "kill masses" of people who opposed his regime. Had Obama did nothing and Kaddafi murdered masses of people the right wing would be saying:" Obama is soft he let a dictator murder people who wanted Democracy..."
Let's sum it once more time- in Obama's 3 years he took out OBL, then about a month ago he took out the number 3 leader of Al-Queada and than 3 days later they captured the commander of the Haqqani network good job President.

Yeah. Uh, what did we win, exactly?

Yeah. Uh, what did we win, exactly? Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Well soon as the announcement of Khaddafi's death the world price of oil dropped 45 cents- they expect within the coming days/weeks that 1.4 billion barrels of oil will be available to the world market which will bring down consumer prices in various areas. Also, the removal of a dictator with the strong possibility of a transition to a Democracy without 1 U.S casualty.
Those are all wins in my book. Also, keep in mind that there were protesters against Kaddafi who were women- revolts like this only hurt Al-Queada and help American. These people are not going to reolt and than have another dictator or a Theocracy.

Ok, oil company profits. Greater National Debt. Americans in harms way. Democracy in Libya? Bwahahaha!!!! Yeah, right.

An elderly old man, begging for his life. Could have stood trial like Mubarak. "Let's kill him!"

You have the most warped values and priorities.

Ok, oil company profits. Greater National Debt. Americans in harms way. Democracy in Libya? Bwahahaha!!!! Yeah, right.

An elderly old man, begging for his life. Could have stood trial like Mubarak. "Let's kill him!"

You have the most warped values and priorities. Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Elderly man??? Who Kaddafi? Hey the rebels asked him to surrender a long time- he's the one that said he will never step down and would rather die than leave Libya- be careful what you wish for.

They could have taken him alive, just as they could have taken OBL alive. This policy of killing anyone we don't like is not good policy. And then to brag about it on the world stage is ridiculous.

They could have taken him alive, just as they could have taken OBL alive. This policy of killing anyone we don't like is not good policy. And then to brag about it on the world stage is ridiculous. Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

COG I guess if you had it your way- if they found Hitler you would have thought that he should be tried and giving 3 meals a day as well- hell I will go further if we found SATAN you would ask if he be given a trial also?
Khadaffi was asked numerous times to turn himself him or leave the country- and where is this "we" it was rebels who killed him- regardless if they caught him alive he would have eventually got executed. What was the end result had the marines who found Saddam put a bullet in his head when they found him in that cave versus the Iraqis hanging him?

Hitler didn't give the Allies the choice. He should have been on trial at Nuremburg. They will never try Satan, he's too involved in government as it is. Has too many friends on the inside.

COG I guess if you had it your way- if they found Hitler you would have thought that he should be tried and giving 3 meals a day as well- hell I will go further if we found SATAN you would ask if he be given a trial also?
Khadaffi was asked numerous times to turn himself him or leave the country- and where is this "we" it was rebels who killed him- regardless if they caught him alive he would have eventually got executed. What was the end result had the marines who found Saddam put a bullet in his head when they found him in that cave versus the Iraqis hanging him? Originally Posted by wellendowed1911

Fact is, the Nazis and the Japanese Imperialists - except for Hirohito - were given trials. EDIT TO ADD: They are still putting Nazis on trial for war crimes.

Another way to interpret the record that you've cited: Bush II - 1 public trial with conviction and execution. Obama - 0 public trials; 4 assassinations. If Obama was a Republican, that's exactly the way you and the press would be looking at it.

Fact is, the Nazis and the Japanese Imperialists - except for Hirohito - were given trials. EDIT TO ADD: They are still putting Nazis on trial for war crimes.

Another way to interpret the record that you've cited: Bush II - 1 public trial with conviction and execution. Obama - 0 public trials; 4 assassinations. If Obama was a Republican, that's exactly the way you and the press would be looking at it. Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Not true- I actually watched Fox news right after OBL was announced dead and none of them took your position that he should have been put on trial. Remember the whole fiasco about having trials held in NYC and the DEM's too heat because you guys said it should have been military tribunes etc. By the way, the U.S did not assassinate Khaddaffi- and as I mentioned before- it was Khadaffi who choose to run and hide- he was asked to relinquish power a long, long, time ago and he said he would rather die(martyr) then leave Libya- fuck the trial he got what he wanted and the people of Libya are happy.

How funny.....if Shrub were responsible for these killings, the republicans would be joyfully waving the flag.

1. COG, I'm starting to think you are an evil shit-stirrer.

2. None of you have any way of knowing whether or not OBL or these other targets could have been taken prisoner and tried or not. Circumstances on the ground with the operators are unknown to you, so absolute statements about tactics that may or may not have been options are nonsense. That having been said, I'm absolutely certain he was ordered to be killed, not taken prisoner and I don't have any problem with that. He killed 3,000 innocent Americans.

3. OBL was a combatant, same as a soldier carrying a rifle on the battlefield. He made his choices and probably died the way he wanted to die. Fuck him.

4. Regarding the American cleric. Same. This guy was actively inciting violence against US citizens. He gave up his right to trial when he left the country and began plotting against us. Enemy combatant. Fuck him.

5. Qaddaffi? We don't even know who killed him yet, do we? Shit, he might have offed himself for all we know. But, the more realistic conclusion is that the resistance fighters killed him. Good riddance to bad rubbish. He's had it coming for a long time. Fuck him.

Does that about cover it?

Not true- I actually watched Fox news right after OBL was announced dead and none of them took your position that he should have been put on trial. Originally Posted by wellendowed1911

Never said that. Only pointed out the hypocrisy of your current position.

Remember the whole fiasco about having trials held in NYC and the DEM's too heat because you guys said it should have been military tribunes etc. By the way, the U.S did not assassinate Khaddaffi- and as I mentioned before- it was Khadaffi who choose to run and hide- he was asked to relinquish power a long, long, time ago and he said he would rather die(martyr) then leave Libya- fuck the trial he got what he wanted and the people of Libya are happy. Originally Posted by wellendowed1911

American bombs flushed him out of his strongholds, he was taken alive and summarily executed (or so it's been reported). Perhaps you are too young to remember the image of the Vietnamese general, Nguyen Ngoc, summarily executing a Viet Cong sniper - it was Johnson's fault because it was part of "Johnson's War" - it didn't matter who actually pulled the trigger . . . or even that the general was justified in shooting that individual.

WE, I never said they shouldn't have trials. The Declaration of Independence says "All men [people] are created equal, and they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights." One of those rights is a right to trial. It's not limited to Americans. It says everyone is created equal. Qadafi ran. He was caught. If we killed him, shame on us. If we didn't, then it isn't relevant, but the President seemed to be taking credit for an assassination, again.

Anything to Bash Obama! If Bush had killed Bin Laden OR Quadaffi the so-called "conservatives" who are really fiscal liberals would be parading in the streets kissing pictures of Bush's ass. Now they are parroting repeated lines from AM HATE RADIO talk show hosts. It's really racism pure and simple.

WE, I never said they shouldn't have trials. The Declaration of Independence says "All men [people] are created equal, and they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights." One of those rights is a right to trial. It's not limited to Americans. It says everyone is created equal. Qadafi ran. He was caught. If we killed him, shame on us. If we didn't, then it isn't relevant, but the President seemed to be taking credit for an assassination, again. Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

WE was trumpeting Gaddafi's assassination as an Obama victory. WE seemed pretty damn proud of that accomplishment. So it's very difficult to see how you can reconcile WE's obvious braying as WE's way of championing Gaddafi's violated civil rights.