We have to retaliate!

Yes , ok but don't all you people that are for this (stupid war IMHO) feel the need to actually pay for it.

Isn't that the least we could do?

We are in debt up to our ass because we have put this war on credit.

I mean none that are for it are actually running over to go fight it.....but the least you could do would be to quit bitching about taxes and go volunteer to pay for this damn war that so many of you are for.

That is how I see it...

squirrel , TheDali......what say you? Originally Posted by WTF

I did not notice in any of the Post in this Thread anyone advocating for this War nor the tax issue. So who are you addressing?
We are in an upside down economic position due to the actions of the Congress and to some extent the present Administration and actions of the previous administrations regarding many issues including the Iraq and Afghan War, as well as the actions against Libya.

I did attempt to go back in the Corps but they turned me down due to my age and refused any attempt on my part for a waiver.

By the by I think the Thread is "We need to retaliate". Are you attempting to jump the Thread?

i'm just hoping that by NOT doing anything we don't allow another hitler to take over somewhere.

Sorry Nktatc I disagree, again, this is not a war against a nation, bombing the crap out of a nation is not the answer and it would certainly would have a repercussion against us from other countries, as much as we may not like their goverments, their cultures, their beliefs or their people, bombing a country for the beliefs of a few is not the answer. If we have a mission to accomplish, let's do it and get out. The problem, in my opinion, is that we have lost sense of the mission and are still there to save face, but the reality is, you can get the the top leadership of the insurgents out and a new leadership will arise. We have won many battles, lost a few (like the latest one) but I believe there is no way for us to win the war, if any of you think that is possible, then you have to accept the loses as much as may not like it, It is a war after all. I again say, bring our boys and girls home. we tried, let's not bleed anymore for a lost cause. Originally Posted by Pica Flor

I think you misread my Post, I did not advocate any of the actions I mentioned as retaliation. I posed them as questions.
What battles have we lost? The '47 shoot down was not a battle. From the news report the helo was en route,and not involved in a vertical envelopement against hostile forces. A Hostile got a shot off with an RPG and the Helo was destroyed end of story. This is War and as tragic as it is that is the sum of it. For a frame of reference 90% of US fixed and rotary wing aircraft losses in VN were do to small arms fire to include RPG's.
I'm unclear what the Mission in Afghanistan is as it appears the Administration is as well. Bin Laden's dead. was that not the mission The Taliban still Exist however. Regarding the beliefs of "A few" I think that should be addressed in a new Thread as it addresses Political and religious issues. By the by the Allies did make war against Civilan populationss of Germany and Japan in WW 2. I make no attempt to justify those actions but they did occur.
I see no point for a US presence in Afghanistan. The Country as it is rural with very few large concentrations of peoples (ie:towns/cities). There is no infrastructure to speak in regards to services, electricity etc. and culturally it is a collection of Tribes (If anything I believe the US should be applying the strategy and tactics applied against the American Indians in the American SW in the 1870's-90's. These were quite brutal but successful for the winning side). As for Iraq it's become a pawn between The US and Iran. Iran is developing nuclear weapons which it will have and since it has a Theocratic Government based on Islam is a frightening issue to me. I could go on and on but I don't want to jump the Thread which I've already appear to be doing.

i'm just hoping that by NOT doing anything we don't allow another hitler to take over somewhere. Originally Posted by houtxgent

WTF....with that attitude we will be jumping all over the world putting out every lil piss ant fire there is.

You do realize that policing the world is very costly. It is the reason every Empire in the history of the world has crumbled.

WTF does jump the thread mean? I just might be.....people that think long term tend to do that. We jump threads from knee jerk reactions. More people would do it, you would not have something like this expensive Iraq mess.

i'm just hoping that by NOT doing anything we don't allow another hitler to take over somewhere. Originally Posted by houtxgent

Just take a look at Iran. We have the French to thank for the past 40 years of upheaval and deaths by their assistance in smuggling Ayatollah Khomeini back into the country for favorable oil contracts whose leadership led to the revolution and fall of the Shah.

(If anything I believe the US should be applying the strategy and tactics applied against the American Indians in the American SW in the 1870's-90's. These were quite brutal but successful for the winning side).. Originally Posted by nktatc

Brutal , yes we murdered the Indians but the second part was getting settlers to move there. How many americans you think are going to move to Afghanistan?

Just take a look at Iran. We have the French to thank for the past 40 years of upheaval and deaths by their assistance in smuggling Ayatollah Khomeini back into the country for favorable oil contracts whose leadership led to the revolution and fall of the Shah. Originally Posted by nktatc

And we have ourself to blame for backing the Shah.....that is a circle jerk that no one will win.

Bottom line, we want that oil and so does everyone else!

Question has always been, how much blood and money are we willing to pay for it.


You can dress that up how ever you want but that is the real deal.

did everyone know that Canada is our major importer of oil? Followed by Brazil? Saudia Arabia is 3rd. Canada superceeds by like 10%.

there's is something else fishy going on in the middle east. not sure i can put my finger on it.

WTF....with that attitude we will be jumping all over the world putting out every lil piss ant fire there is.

You do realize that policing the world is very costly. It is the reason every Empire in the history of the world has crumbled.

WTF does jump the thread mean? I just might be.....people that think long term tend to do that. We jump threads from knee jerk reactions. More people would do it, you would not have something like this expensive Iraq mess. Originally Posted by WTF

I never said anything about or promoted world police. Those were your words, not mine. Just making sure you understand that. :-)

Wars are fought to promote the agenda of the global elite (royalty, international bankers, and international corporations). Their agenda includes control of every human being on the planet, and then the systematic elimination of 80 to 90 % of the worlds population. If you think your sons and daughters should die for that agenda, then you are a brainwashed fool (IMHO).

LS

Wars are fought to promote the agenda of the global elite (royalty, international bankers, and international corporations). Their agenda includes control of every human being on the planet, and then the systematic elimination of 80 to 90 % of the worlds population. If you think your sons and daughters should die for that agenda, then you are a brainwashed fool (IMHO).

LS Originally Posted by LittleSpike

WOW

If one lives in a snake pit, don't bitch when one gets bitten, .....

.... but damn sure kill the snake.

I never said anything about or promoted world police. Those were your words, not mine. Just making sure you understand that. :-) Originally Posted by houtxgent

Explain this then....

i'm just hoping that by NOT doing anything we don't allow another hitler to take over somewhere. Originally Posted by houtxgent

Do you want us to do something or not? Ever hawk that ever lived brings up Hitler. It is how they justify spending money on Defense that we do not have. They want to borrow from future generations to pay for their safety. They do not want to raise taxes presently to do so.


Those are just facts. They are not pretty but you can not argue their truthfulness.

ok, truthfulness.

sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don't.

fyi, (again) i never stated i'm for or against involvement in foreign affairs. i'm just stating "truthfulness". I understand your angst, but I think it's a tad misplaced in my direction.

i think in some scenarios it is crucial to get involved in foreign affairs. in other cases, it's wrong. right now, we need to repair our own economy (just like China started doing about 10 years ago). I don't want to do it just like China did. I"m just saying it should be a focus.

however, NONE of us have ALL the facts. we never will. so here we are debating over the scraps of information we have available to us. i'll just stick to my morals.

The nukes are paid for......let's use them.