Pennsylvania new laws coming...

Nice observations Eye, Are there any LE "tools" in this new law (which the Governor did sign btw) that would change any of that?

I'll go one step further, if you solicit ANY Korean or Asian business, chances are its involved in trafficking.

With the rare exception of Asians who actually OWN their own business, most Chinese restaurants, nail salons, and all AMPs are using people being trafficked.

Plain and simple, when the "J Spa" and all the other major Westmoreland County Asian AMPs went down, I knew the attorney representing dozens of the men who were J Spa customers, and who were threatened by the Nazi DA of Westmoco with having their names made public, just for doing CC business at J Spa and others.

Once the attorney told the DA that 40 plus guys were ready to sue if their names were made public, Goebbels stepped back.

Basically, 99 percent of all Asian workers have to finance their trip here, they are given instructions on how to work the welfare system, as, none of them will ever be paid in cash, so they never have income, and they are given jobs based on their education and skills.

If you can run a restaurant, you are given one to run, and given 3 or 4 male indentured servants to work off THEIR loans.

Some nail skills, you get to work your loans off at a nail salon, too stupid to do anything but fuck, you get sent to an AMP.

Basically, you are fed and cared for at the minimum cost to the person in charge of you, and utilize the welfare system for food, perhaps housing, but most live 10 to 30 in a house, because they don't want you to become independent.

IF you are getting your nails done, you are supporting slavery, plain and simple.

Same with Chinese food, you support the Asian mafia.

Problem is, the Government can't find support for shutting down nail salons and food joints.

Everybody has an issue with whoring, the rest, not so much.

Oh, ever wonder why every Asian restaurant serves french fries?

Its what most of the workers live on, and, every cent is written off as an expense, the cheapest food you can buy.

I've seen it, strictly rice will give you Beri Beri, but, as the Irish showed, you can survive on potatoes.

And, if you disagree, it was in part my Irish relatives who did just that.

Mr. Devo
It really is a good thing that you have all of the answers, I will have to ask the girls that work for us who is pulling their strings.
We bought our massage parlor ourselves from someone that had either built it themselves or bought it from someone that did the same and the same goes for the other 4 places that we owned before.
It is quite possible that organised crime maybe involved in the nail business but only in a loansharking sense, those places are around $100,000 at the low end.
Whatever happened at J-spa I have no idea note do I care because it must have been some time ago for me not to have heard of it, if they were fucking it was most likely it Chinese.
Do I believe that trafficking does not happen of course it dose, but the majority of the Amps in this area are as I previously described.
What you do not realize is that these girls come here with money.
China and Korea are not the poor third world countries that they used to be.
The one girl that worked for us is married to a banker in China with plenty of Chen she likes living here and he there.
And an ex girlfriend of mine that was and still is a massage girl, her daddy is the CEO of a corporation in China that makes the transformers for our telephone poles last I saw her she wasn't hurting for money either, nor do I believe she had a handler I am sur I would have at least bumped into him at least once.
I can assure you that 98% of these girls are doing this because they want to or like the money they can bring in.
And the only places that fucking regularly occurs as a career choice is in the Korean places.
Will Chinese girls fuck sure, most times of they like you rarely just for the money.
Don't believe me as a litmus test go to our Amp Spa section, hjs sure, occasional bjs, but fucking is quite rare.
And believe me these guys would tell.
But believe as you may.

Gotta agree with DF here. Typically I'd say that there is some level of management to girls in rotation to different shops where they speak little to o English but I dont think its like. An unwilling situation in most situations. Maybe in coastal cities that are large and have large population of asians that might occur more greatly but here in round-eye land- not so much. Any of these ladies who interact with the gen population could say something. There are some things that are not legal in some shops but not that uncommon. Typically the big one in PA is sleeping / living in commercial buildings with no residency permits. Stupidly...thats the one that shuts most down eventually. Or at least gets landlords to boot them out. But as they pay rent, most landlords either know, are patrons or dont give 2 shits as they get their rent in time. And of course the other busts that make the news on election cycles. Its almost always politics.

The state of pa does make it more difficult to be prosecuted because if the police cant directly see evidence of wrong doing, then its hard for them to prove it privately happening without an undercover LEO going in. Pa laws on recording conversations is really strict in that legally they must obtain permission from any party who would otherwise assume privacy to record them. Both video and specifically audio. If its in a public area -totally different as there is no assumption of privacy in public. Originally Posted by eyecu2

The PA Wiretap Act contains an explicit defense of having a warrant or court order, a grand jury subpeona and a couple of other things. Case law basically means that with a warrant, you are looking at one party consent, best case. Plus, the feds, who are often charging and/or participating in these cases, don't have the PA wiretap act issues in Title III.

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I'll go one step further, if you solicit ANY Korean or Asian business, chances are its involved in trafficking.

With the rare exception of Asians who actually OWN their own business, most Chinese restaurants, nail salons, and all AMPs are using people being trafficked.

Plain and simple, when the "J Spa" and all the other major Westmoreland County Asian AMPs went down, I knew the attorney representing dozens of the men who were J Spa customers, and who were threatened by the Nazi DA of Westmoco with having their names made public, just for doing CC business at J Spa and others.

Once the attorney told the DA that 40 plus guys were ready to sue if their names were made public, Goebbels stepped back.

Basically, 99 percent of all Asian workers have to finance their trip here, they are given instructions on how to work the welfare system, as, none of them will ever be paid in cash, so they never have income, and they are given jobs based on their education and skills.

If you can run a restaurant, you are given one to run, and given 3 or 4 male indentured servants to work off THEIR loans.

Some nail skills, you get to work your loans off at a nail salon, too stupid to do anything but fuck, you get sent to an AMP.

Basically, you are fed and cared for at the minimum cost to the person in charge of you, and utilize the welfare system for food, perhaps housing, but most live 10 to 30 in a house, because they don't want you to become independent.

IF you are getting your nails done, you are supporting slavery, plain and simple.

Same with Chinese food, you support the Asian mafia.

Problem is, the Government can't find support for shutting down nail salons and food joints.

Everybody has an issue with whoring, the rest, not so much. Originally Posted by Devo

You are fucking nuts. It's bad enough that you think every amp is filled with human trafficking victims, but you actually want to extend that smear to every Asian business out there, including restaurants and nail salons? Where do come up with these crazy ideas?

Asians tend to save a helluva lot more money than we do. Dawg is right - many of the girls come here with money. But even if they finance their trip, so what? By your logic, anyone who takes out a loan to go to college, then graduates and takes a job to pay off this debt is an indentured servant.

Some immigrants assimilate faster than others. That was true for Irish and Italians a century ago, Latinos more recently - all immigrant communities. Just because some Asians who come here speak very little English and tend to live initially in their own Chinese or Korean enclaves doesn't mean they're being trafficked.

The only thing stupider than saying human trafficking doesn't exist anywhere is to claim it exists everywhere. Daayyuumm... now I'm supposed to feel guilty of "supporting slavery" anytime I sit down for dim sum or shop in Chinatown? Get real!

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The only thing stupider than saying human trafficking doesn't exist anywhere is to claim it exists everywhere. Originally Posted by lustylad

I dont believe it exists everywhere, but I'm damn sure it exists in most AMP's.

I dont think anyone should feel guilty for what they decide to do or not do, thats your own choice.

My choice is to only spend time with ladies that I can assure to the best of my ability are not being trafficked and I think the % of women in AMP's is high enough that your kidding yourself if you think you frequent them and have never been with a trafficked woman.

Having said that, I support laws that protect trafficked women even if it means changes to my habit.

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I dont believe it exists everywhere, but I'm damn sure it exists in most AMP's.

I dont think anyone should feel guilty for what they decide to do or not do, thats your own choice.

My choice is to only spend time with ladies that I can assure to the best of my ability are not being trafficked and I think the % of women in AMP's is high enough that your kidding yourself if you think you frequent them and have never been with a trafficked woman.

Having said that, I support laws that protect trafficked women even if it means changes to my habit. Originally Posted by sjomonty

Exactly. Devo is way off base but so is Dogface (aka The Operator) and Lustylad. Dogface is in the AMP business so he doesn't want to talk about trafficking because it would hurt his/ his wife's business and cut down on the number of potential employees they can hire.

The bottom line is trafficking does not exist everywhere, but it exists in a number of AMP's and in those chinese / korean girls "visiting" with false pics working out of hotel rooms.

And trafficking is not just the picture painted on TV of smuggling or locking someone up, forcing them to do this, etc. Trafficking can take different forms. So some girl from China has someone pay their freight to come over to the US with a promise of a nebulous job and then has to work off that debt in jack shack AMPs. Or a chinese mom has debts to pay and has to support her family so she answers an ad promising work in America only to find out once here she has been misled and is in no position to say no. Often those girls live in those AMPs and most of the earnings go to pay off the debt. Sometimes their ID documents are held. No one is literally holding them with a gun to their head - but they are stuck there until they work off the debt they agreed to. Also in some cultures they have other means of keeping a girl in line (some do not want to bring shame to their family by not "paying off their debt" to get them to the US, some were "sold" by their families into this, some can be kept in line with threats against the family, etc.)

This is a much more encompassing definition of trafficking:

Trafficking is officially defined as the recruitment, transportation, transfer, harboring, or receipt of persons by means of coercion, abduction, fraud, deception, or abuse of power of a position of vulnerability for the purpose of exploitation. Human trafficking is not synonymous with forced migration or smuggling.

So here Devo is right on one aspect - it doesn't have to be limited to the sex trade business.

Now all that said, people should make their own choices and see who they are comfortable seeing. I am not a huge AMP fan but that is because I typically prefer more than a rub and a tug. But I have gone and will go to AMPs on occasion. This is a shady hobby to begin with so no matter what you do, you are supporting something illegal

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You are fucking nuts. It's bad enough that you think every amp is filled with human trafficking victims, but you actually want to extend that smear to every Asian business out there, including restaurants and nail salons? Where do come up with these crazy ideas?

Asians tend to save a helluva lot more money than we do. Dawg is right - many of the girls come here with money. But even if they finance their trip, so what? By your logic, anyone who takes out a loan to go to college, then graduates and takes a job to pay off this debt is an indentured servant.

Some immigrants assimilate faster than others. That was true for Irish and Italians a century ago, Latinos more recently - all immigrant communities. Just because some Asians who come here speak very little English and tend to live initially in their own Chinese or Korean enclaves doesn't mean they're being trafficked.

The only thing stupider than saying human trafficking doesn't exist anywhere is to claim it exists everywhere. Daayyuumm... now I'm supposed to feel guilty of "supporting slavery" anytime I sit down for dim sum or shop in Chinatown? Get real! Originally Posted by lustylad

Mmmmm... dim sum. Yes please

Exactly. Devo is way off base but so is Dogface (aka The Operator) and Lustylad. Dogface is in the AMP business so he doesn't want to talk about trafficking because it would hurt his/ his wife's business and cut down on the number of potential employees they can hire. Originally Posted by berryberry

Call me who you will IDC, but I am talking about it now!
What I am saying I am saying because you want an honest assement of what happens in Chinese Amps in this area and I am giving you that.
Trafficking dose not cut down on the employees we can hire because the operative word is, and you used yourself and it is accurate is "Hire and Employees"!
People that are being trafficked are called Slaves or SERVANTS!
Our girls are HIRED and become our EMPLOYEES, they are free to come and go as they wish as Pa. being an at will employment state.
I am also not aware of any other owner of one of these establishments that holds people in servitude, and I kwow a lot of them.
As I said in my last post if this situation is so rampant why are these places "Amps" not shut down wholesale?

Call me who you will IDC, but I am talking about it now!
What I am saying I am saying because you want an honest assement of what happens in Chinese Amps in this area and I am giving you that.
Trafficking dose not cut down on the employees we can hire because the operative word is, and you used yourself and it is accurate is "Hire and Employees"!
People that are being trafficked are called Slaves or SERVANTS!
Our girls are HIRED and become our EMPLOYEES, they are free to come and go as they wish as Pa. being an at will employment state.
I am also not aware of any other owner of one of these establishments that holds people in servitude, and I kwow a lot of them.
As I said in my last post if this situation is so rampant why are these places "Amps" not shut down wholesale? Originally Posted by Dogface78

LOL - I am calling you the accurate names. Quit trying to play coy. You were here under The Operator name - and got banned. Then you created this new Dogface name to get around the ban and come back early (against the rules).

You obviously did not read what I wrote - not everyone who is trafficked are using your lingo, "Slaves or SERVANTS"

Trafficking takes many forms, I pointed out one of the most common examples - A Chinese mom has debts to pay and has to support her family so she answers an ad promising work in America only to find out once here she has been misled and is in no position to say no to giving hand jobs at your jack shack. Technically she may be an employee - but she has no choice. That is the "abuse of power of a position of vulnerability" which is trafficking.

But go on pretending you and all the other AMPS are upstanding citizens of this state and do nothing illegal.

As I said, people should make their own choices and see who they are comfortable seeing. This is a shady hobby to begin with so no matter what you do (amp / independent provider / girl with a habit / girl with a manager / independent provider / etc), you are supporting something illegal/ Up to everyone to make their own choice what they are comfortable with

LOL, you really haven't a clue!

Call me who you will IDC, but I am talking about it now!
What I am saying I am saying because you want an honest assement of what happens in Chinese Amps in this area and I am giving you that.
Trafficking dose not cut down on the employees we can hire because the operative word is, and you used yourself and it is accurate is "Hire and Employees"!
People that are being trafficked are called Slaves or SERVANTS!
Our girls are HIRED and become our EMPLOYEES, they are free to come and go as they wish as Pa. being an at will employment state.
I am also not aware of any other owner of one of these establishments that holds people in servitude, and I kwow a lot of them.
As I said in my last post if this situation is so rampant why are these places "Amps" not shut down wholesale? Originally Posted by Dogface78

Actually, an independent contractor can come and go as they please. An employee has to work when their employers want them to work within the law.