The Problem With Obamacare Is Obamacare

  • Tiny
  • 11-09-2025, 01:36 PM
Chucky Schumer continues to extort the country and the GOP as he seeks to raid the fisc by demanding a one-year extension of those ridiculously generous enhanced ACA subsidies that the Democrats originally assured everyone were supposed to be a "temporary" covid-relief measure that they wanted to expire by year-end.

In Washington DC you are allowed to "fail up". If a government program turns into a giant clusterfuck, you don't shut it down or replace it or even reform it. You just reward failure by throwing MORE taxpayer money at it! That's the Dem philosophy. Along with "never let a good crisis go to waste" - in this case, Covid-19 was the crisis. Pretend your bailout is only TEMPORARY, but then when it's due to expire you hold the federal government hostage to making it PERMANENT.

Here's some good background reading:

https://cei.org/blog/the-problem-wit...-is-obamacare/ Originally Posted by lustylad

In 2009, a family of 4 that made less than $125,000 got a tax credit to help pay the premium. What Biden did in 2021 was increase the maximum number so that a family of 4 that made more than $125,000 would be eligible for a tax credit to help pay for the premium. The tax credits for higher income people were suppose to expire 12/31/2025. Senator Chuck is trying to get these tax credits extended for at least another year. This is the latest compromise that he has offered. Originally Posted by adav8s28
The problem is that health care expenditures in the USA are 18% of GDP. That's much higher than any other country. The next highest in the OECD, Germany, clocks in at about 12.5%. Ireland at 7%. And we're not getting what we're paying for. The USA is 55th in the world in terms of life expectancy, behind Panama, Albania, and Costa Rica among many others.

The "temporary" changes to the ACA that are the subject of the dispute would provide tax credits, paid directly to insurers, to every American, regardless of income, who would pay over 8.5% of his income in health insurance for a silver plan. You do have some out of pocket payments when you're on Obamacare, but including those you'll end up paying maybe 9% to 12% of your adjusted gross income for health care, according to ChatGPT.

So, in other words, health care expenditures are 18% of GDP. But the maximum people will actually pay for their health care, including insurance, is 12%. Some, particularly those on Medicare and Medicaid and company-provided insurance, pay much less.

The government pays the Obamacare tax credits directly to the insurance companies. Do the insurance companies have any motivation to keep costs down? Well, yes. That will improve their bottom lines. But they have even more motivation to raise their premiums and grab more money from Uncle Sam. This is like government support for higher education through easy-to-get loans to students that later will presumably be forgiven. That enabled colleges to raise their tuitions sky high.

Stephen Moore was on CSPAN the other day, and he said all Americans should be covered by major medical insurance. And for non catastrophic medical care, they should pay out of pocket. Then they'd have the motivation to shop around. The free market would work. Costs would come down a lot. Hospitals and providers would have to compete on price.

You could marry Moore's idea to something like mandated HSA accounts, like what Singapore does, where employers and individuals mostly fund the accounts. You can withdraw money from your HSA investment account to pay for medical care. Singapore's health care expenditures are 5.6% of GDP, less than 1/3rd of the USA's, and life expectancy is 8th highest in the world.

So why don't the political parties do something? Why is there a shutdown? Well, Blackman knows more about Democratic Party politics than anyone here. He says Democrats have the motivation to draw the shutdown out as long as possible, because it will help them at the polls. Schumer's idea, to extend the credits for higher income taxpayers for a year, would fortuitously bring this issue to a head again just in time for the 2026 midterm elections, which would play into Democrats' hands. As to the Republican Party, a lot of the Congressmen and Senators correctly recognize the problem, but they're too busy addressing more important issues, like which bathroom shemales should use.
txdot-guy's Avatar
The biggest fail was that is was implemented by one side. Originally Posted by Precious_b
Absolutely. If we'd had a bipartisan solution for unaffordable health care maybe we wouldn't be in this mess. Originally Posted by Tiny
The biggest problem is that the health insurance industry was involved in the passage of the ACA.

A single payer system excluding the insurance industry is the preferred solution.
Single payer AKA...GUMMENT
Nothing like bigger gumment.
That system works all over the world.
txdot-guy's Avatar
Single payer AKA...GUMMENT
Nothing like bigger gumment.
That system works all over the world. Originally Posted by bb1961
Actually it does work in a lot of places. Including Taiwan and South Korea and Japan, And most of Europe and the Nordic Countries.

Read about it here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-payer_healthcare
And those places have nowhere near the population of the USA. And most people in those countries would go to another country for care or surgery rather than wait an unknown amount of time for anything. The quality of care in those countries isn't exactly at US standards either.
Please don't burst his utopian bubble...
txdot-guy's Avatar
Take a look at the statistics.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...de-by-country/

Healthcare satisfaction by country as of 2019. Lots more countries are more satisfied than the US.

Including Singapore, The UK, Australia, France, Canada, Japan, Sweden Hong Kong.

There are problems with the ACA but they are fixable. Going back to a time before the ACA is not the solution.
Adorable Care Act...rates about to sky rocket...so much for affordable care. UNaffordable care act is more intune with that nonsense that the Republicans knew was a disaster before the left shoved it down the throats of the American people. This is ALL laid at the feet of the LEFT not the RIGHT!!
How many Republicans went along with this COMPLETE disaster??...DO tell
txdot-guy's Avatar
Adorable Care Act...rates about to sky rocket...so much for affordable care. UNaffordable care act is more intune with that nonsense that the Republicans knew was a disaster before the left shoved it down the throats of the American people. This is ALL laid at the feet of the LEFT not the RIGHT!!
How many Republicans went along with this COMPLETE disaster??...DO tell Originally Posted by bb1961
Please tell us how it’s better without the ACA. I distinctly remember a time when my small business couldn’t afford to pay for comprehensive healthcare for my employees anymore because it was just too expensive. I remember a time when pre existing conditions kept people from getting healthcare. I remember a time when a bad healthcare diagnosis would bankrupt a family. The ACA maybe a little more expensive than people would like but at least it covers everyone.

If the Republicans had a better plan then they should have done better than just oppose the ACA.
SpeedRacerXXX's Avatar
Please tell us how it’s better without the ACA. I distinctly remember a time when my small business couldn’t afford to pay for comprehensive healthcare for my employees anymore because it was just too expensive. I remember a time when pre existing conditions kept people from getting healthcare. I remember a time when a bad healthcare diagnosis would bankrupt a family. The ACA maybe a little more expensive than people would like but at least it covers everyone.

If the Republicans had a better plan then they should have done better than just oppose the ACA. Originally Posted by txdot-guy
Republicans have had the opportunity since 2009 to come up with a better healthcare plan than the ACA and have not done so. Trump says he has a "concept" of a plan. The ACA certainly has its downside but until something better comes along I fully support it and have no problem with some of my tax dollars paying for it.

I am on Medicare. Like the ACA it is mostly funded by taxpayers. Like people on the ACA, I would be paying MUCH more if I had to purchase health insurance on the open market. I am sure many of the complaints against the ACA would also apply against Medicare.
Precious_b's Avatar
Absolutely. If we'd had a bipartisan solution for unaffordable health care maybe we wouldn't be in this mess. Originally Posted by Tiny
The biggest problem is that the health insurance industry was involved in the passage of the ACA.

A single payer system excluding the insurance industry is the preferred solution. Originally Posted by txdot-guy
This is a pluperfect, ideal time for the repubs to show how much they care about their constituents and display that they can make a bipartisan piece of legislation that truly helps this country concerning healthcare.

As a developed nation, we pay a high price with small returns. Should be easy to change with both teams working on it.
texassapper's Avatar
Should be easy to change with both teams working on it. Originally Posted by Precious_b
Both teams will never work on it because the focus for democrats is single payer state run healthcare. The conservative case is for more competition. Leftists will oppose any reform that might make things better for consumers because their goal for consumers is to have the state run healthcare and to control the health choices of citizens.

The two goals are mutually exclusive.

We can all look around and see that increased competition reduces prices... see mobile phones, airline tickets etc... We can also look around and see what happens when the state controls anything... it gets worse, its corrupt, its wasteful, and we cannot reduce or get rid of it.

Leftists want control over your medical choices as just another way to control the population... don't like what someone posted online? Make sure their kid can't get that transplant...
Why_Yes_I_Do's Avatar
Republicans have had the opportunity since 2009 to come up with a better healthcare plan than the ACA and have not done so... Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX
Notwithstanding that the Left-Wing nuts have been working on theirs since the early 1990's HillaryCare.


...I am on Medicare. Like the ACA it is mostly funded by taxpayers... Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX
By taxpayers, do you mean; such as yourself? Like during your entire working career by way of mandatory deductions from each and every paycheck of that working career, by chance?!?
  • Tiny
  • Yesterday, 02:06 PM
A single payer system excluding the insurance industry is the preferred solution. Originally Posted by txdot-guy
Switzerland, Germany, the Netherlands, Japan, Austria and Belgium among others don't have a single payer system. They have much lower costs and better healthcare outcomes than the USA, and than some countries with single payer systems. Yeah, the insurance industry in the USA is a big problem. Government, businesses and individuals throw money their way and they jack up prices. The free market isn't working.
  • Tiny
  • Yesterday, 02:09 PM
We can all look around and see that increased competition reduces prices... see mobile phones, airline tickets etc... We can also look around and see what happens when the state controls anything... it gets worse, its corrupt, its wasteful, and we cannot reduce or get rid of it. Originally Posted by texassapper
That's the case with the federal government. I might trust Greg Abbott and the Texas legislature, or Bill Clinton for that matter, to run a single payer system, but the clowns in Washington would most likely fuck it up.