Congrats Emmitt Smith, Hall of Fame Class of 2010

no offense to Jim Brown, who I think is a great running back but not the best of all time....if its fair to mention Jim Brown running behind Dallas' OL then its fair to say that Emmitt faced more talented, more skilled and obviously much physically stronger defensive players that Jim Brown faced. Jim Brown was a freak and was a man playing amongst boys so to speak.

as far as Barry Sanders, I thought he was more talented than Emmitt, but he was also a quitter. so who knows, he took himself out of the equation. like gale sayers, we can talk about "what ifs" all day....


lets talk about Dallas' OL, where were they drafted? how were they were acquired? hell even one of them was from plan B free agency(Nate Newton). they werent blue chippers coming out of college, they werent considered the most talented when they were acquired, they were made in-house from the Cowboys coaching staff and practicing against one of the best defenses in the league.

It doesn't really matter where those OL men were drafted, its how they performed. How many Pro Bowls did those guys go to? They blew open massive holes and gave Troy a ton of time. I remember coming to work after listening to those TV announcers fawn over Emmitt and laughing with my co workers about how much daylight the guy had.

IMHO, Troy isn't HOF worthy. Other than SB rings, he doesn't have the numbers. Even Danny White was a better Cowboy QB. Irvin is a marginal HOF but I'll admit I hate the guy as a commentator. He's in and Andre Reed is not in? Ridiculous. Emmitt has to be in the Hall just because of his numbers but I believe a lot of other RBs would put up similar numbers with the line he had from 1991-1996.

Jerry also overpaid for the Triplets when he resigned them. Then he couldn't resign Stephnoski or other DL/OL talent and the triplets never had the same success.
Sure, those guys were coached, just like every other person in the league.

my point about the OL for the Boys, is that they were not celebrated before they came to the Boys and only had success with the Boys and with Emmitt's success. the last line you mentioned about every other person in the league being coached I dont understand your point, sure every player has coaches but the Boys coaches got these guys who were not celebrated before they came to the Boys to play at a higher level and used them effectively to help win games. I dont think every other person in the league became superbowl champions, pro bowlers and all pros just because they were coached too. considering you're from Houston, I can see how you think that way since the oilers or texans havent had anywhere the amount of success the Cowboys have had.

I hate the argument of the OL. It's more like LOL!! If jerry rice had JaMarcus Russell and Ryan Leaf as quarterbacks for 20 years, would be have all the records? If you say yes, you obviously don't watch football and HATE the Cowboys and love SF 49ers lol.

Just sayin... Emmitt could spin, juke, BLOCKKKKKKKKK, catch, BLOCKKKKK, run fast, BLOCKKKK. Get my drift?

Top 5 easy, maybe Top 3 of all-time.

as far as Barry Sanders, I thought he was more talented than Emmitt, but he was also a quitter. so who knows, he took himself out of the equation. like gale sayers, we can talk about "what ifs" all day.... Originally Posted by TexRich

Barry Sanders retired rather than break Walter Peyton's all time rushing record that was done through many very bad Bears team.

To call a player who retired rather than break that record a quitter is bullshit.

no offense to Jim Brown, who I think is a great running back but not the best of all time....if its fair to mention Jim Brown running behind Dallas' OL then its fair to say that Emmitt faced more talented, more skilled and obviously much physically stronger defensive players that Jim Brown faced. Jim Brown was a freak and was a man playing amongst boys so to speak. Originally Posted by TexRich

Brown played in the era of some of the dirtiest playing ever. Cut blocks, clothesline tackle, you name it. AND Jim Brown only played what, 9 seasons?
Freak or not, if you have watched his film, you would have seen a back that was incredible and if not mistaken, still holds the record for avg yards per carry. Throw Emmit Smith and Jim Brown behind the same line of any era and I'd bet you a session with your ATF that Jim Brown would come out way ahead.

lets talk about Dallas' OL, where were they drafted? how were they were acquired? hell even one of them was from plan B free agency(Nate Newton). they werent blue chippers coming out of college, they werent considered the most talented when they were acquired, they were made in-house from the Cowboys coaching staff and practicing against one of the best defenses in the league. Originally Posted by TexRich

BUT, when Dallas traded Herschel Walker, they got a tons of picks along with plenty of players that were then traded for other talent in many combinations.
Here's a summary: LOOK at the names who turned out to be all star players so don't even try to say there weren't blue chippers acquired for that dynamic team of the 90's.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herschel_Walker_trade
Minnesota Vikings received
RB Herschel Walker
Dallas's 3rd round pick - 1990 (54) (Mike Jones)
San Diego's 5th round pick - 1990 (116) (Reggie Thornton)
Dallas's 10th round pick - 1990 (249) (Pat Newman)
Dallas's 3rd round pick - 1991 (68) (Jake Reed)
Dallas Cowboys received
LB Jesse Solomon
LB David Howard
CB Issiac Holt
RB Darrin Nelson (traded to San Diego after he refused to report to Dallas)
DE Alex Stewart
Minnesota's 1st round pick in 1990 (21) (traded this pick along with pick (81) for pick (17) from Pittsburgh to draft Emmitt Smith)
Minnesota's 2nd round pick in 1990 (47) (Alexander Wright)
Minnesota's 6th round pick in 1990 (158) (traded to New Orleans, who drafted James Williams)
Minnesota's 1st round pick in 1991 (conditional) - (12) (Alvin Harper)
Minnesota's 2nd round pick in 1991 (conditional) - (38) (Dixon Edwards)
Minnesota's 2nd round pick in 1992 (conditional) - (37) (Darren Woodson)
Minnesota's 3rd round pick in 1992 (conditional) - (71) (traded to New England, who drafted Kevin Turner)
Minnesota's 1st round pick in 1993 (conditional) - (13) (traded to Philadelphia Eagles, and then to the Houston Oilers, who drafted Brad Hopkins)

That trade is what enabled the Cowboys to even draft Emmit. Without the linesmen on both sides of the ball, Emmit would have been killed. A strong defense for the Cowboys allowed their offense to be fresh when they'd take the field.

Look at how Troy got the dog shit hammered out of him until they made the trade and built that offensive line. Troy was not a very mobile QB. How many rushing touchdowns did he make in his career or how many first downs did Troy make when scrambling? Not many.

Emmit is in the HoF. Good for him, the last of the trifecta is there. Maybe they need to induct Norv Turner also because without his skill in getting the most out of the entire offense, none of them would have been successful.

But he is far from the best ever just because he rushed for so many yards.

It's refreshing to find someone else who hasn't been bamboozled by the Cowpie propaganda mill.
Had Jim Brown run behind Emmit's offensive line he would have set the bar even higher. Originally Posted by Chainsaw Anthropologist

and had Barry Sanders not quit at an early age Smith would never caught him

my point about the OL for the Boys, is that they were not celebrated before they came to the Boys and only had success with the Boys and with Emmitt's success. the last line you mentioned about every other person in the league being coached I dont understand your point, sure every player has coaches but the Boys coaches got these guys who were not celebrated before they came to the Boys to play at a higher level and used them effectively to help win games. I dont think every other person in the league became superbowl champions, pro bowlers and all pros just because they were coached too. considering you're from Houston, I can see how you think that way since the oilers or texans havent had anywhere the amount of success the Cowboys have had. Originally Posted by TexRich

They were mostly drafted in the 3rd round or higher. Not a lot of OL men who aren't premier left tackles are drafted in the first round. Some like Boselli and Mandarich didn't live up to the hype. Your 'celebrated' argument like your 'coached' argument is very weak. They had the ability to bulldoze people which translated into success for the Triplets. They will not be rewarded by HOF honors even though they are more deserving then 2 of the 3 of the Trips. Part of the issue is that the HOF doesn't reward OL. Offensively, they basically only recognize 'skill' positions.

Don't you remember when the Cowboys were being trounced how opposing team defenses said how easy and predictable Dallas' offense was? It was thought that Jimmy Johnson was going to be another college coach who failed in the NFL. Even after the OL was assembled it was predictable. The difference was the personnel in the O line.

Barry Sanders and Brown would have run further than Emmit behind the Dallas OL. Eric Dickerson would have run further even though he had one of the top OLs in the Slater Rams. I think Earl might have hit 2300 yards in a season. I just don't see a lot of safeties throwing themselves in front of him with a 15 yard head of steam.

FYI, I was born and raised in Oak Cliff. The first Cowboy game I attended in person they beat Detroit 56-13. Look it up.

IMHO, Troy isn't HOF worthy. Other than SB rings, he doesn't have the numbers. Even Danny White was a better Cowboy QB. Originally Posted by gnadfly

He ended his career as the Cowboys' all-time leading passer (32,942 yards). 90 of his 94 career wins were in the 1990s and were the most by any quarterback in any decade until Peyton Manning surpassed him in the 2000s with 115 wins. This makes Aikman 3rd on time on that list (Tom Brady is second with 97).[3][10]

Danny White a better QB than Troy Aikman??? Come on now...

sixx

gnadfly,

I forgot about Earl Campbell. Talk about a damn freak! HUGE and strong as an ox. Putting him behind that Cowboy line would have been a joy to watch.

gnad, whatever your name is, 3rd round is not blue chippers, so go back and read what I wrote. They were not celebrated coming out of college either way and like I said some were other team's trash or no one wanted. so there goes that for you.

them not being rewared HOF honors has nothing to do with the Triplets earning it or not, thats an indictment on the standards that have been in place by the HOF, so thats a pathetic argument. the standards that are there made them worthy, you can argue all day whether or not other players are deserving or not, but the players dont decide they just put their numbers, their accomplishments and their playing out there for those in power to decide. they were being trounced in the beginning because they had dave shula as their O.C, and when he was fired and Norv Turner came in things changed because the "coaching" changed and Norv set up a system that helped the offense succeed. thanks for making my argument for me dude! now dave shula is the president of his daddy's steak house business nowhere near a professional football team. I bet now he can cook up a good steak but then again maybe not, LOL!!!!

its stupid as hell to suggest other players would have done this and that, because it didnt happen, it hadnt and never will, you must be in la la land to think that way, I and most people rather deal with facts and empirical proof rather than what ifs and such I only used the one suggestion to appease you but now looking at it, it was just as stupid as day dreaming all day about stuff that never happened.

as far as the coaching, you have to be an idiot not to get that, coaching and systems have a lot to do with helping a player succeed, or be someone to have never played football other than pee wee, flag football or fantasy......

gnadfly,

I forgot about Earl Campbell. Talk about a damn freak! HUGE and strong as an ox. Putting him behind that Cowboy line would have been a joy to watch. Originally Posted by LazurusLong

I know one thing he does well, and its not daydreaming, he makes a good sausage to grill with!

He ended his career as the Cowboys' all-time leading passer (32,942 yards). 90 of his 94 career wins were in the 1990s and were the most by any quarterback in any decade until Peyton Manning surpassed him in the 2000s with 115 wins. This makes Aikman 3rd on time on that list (Tom Brady is second with 97).[3][10]

Danny White a better QB than Troy Aikman??? Come on now...

sixx
Originally Posted by sixxbach

dont let real life numbers get in the way, but then again numbers alone didnt win games, divisions, conference titles and superbowls, he would rather daydream about what ifs and what could have been if so and so had this and that.....

He ended his career as the Cowboys' all-time leading passer (32,942 yards). 90 of his 94 career wins were in the 1990s and were the most by any quarterback in any decade until Peyton Manning surpassed him in the 2000s with 115 wins. This makes Aikman 3rd on time on that list (Tom Brady is second with 97).[3][10]

Danny White a better QB than Troy Aikman??? Come on now...

sixx
Originally Posted by sixxbach

Yes. Danny White a better QB than Troy. Team wins are a meaningless HOF stats. You should induct most of the team then.

After they changed the rules to where a DB couldn't look at a WR without a penalty all QB stats popped. 300 yd games became common place. Go look at Troy's career passing stats. He's like 20th. Never close to being the dominating QB in any year he was in the league.

gnad, whatever your name is, 3rd round is not blue chippers, so go back and read what I wrote. They were not celebrated coming out of college either way and like I said some were other team's trash or no one wanted. so there goes that for you.

them not being rewared HOF honors has nothing to do with the Triplets earning it or not, thats an indictment on the standards that have been in place by the HOF, so thats a pathetic argument. the standards that are there made them worthy, you can argue all day whether or not other players are deserving or not, but the players dont decide they just put their numbers, their accomplishments and their playing out there for those in power to decide. they were being trounced in the beginning because they had dave shula as their O.C, and when he was fired and Norv Turner came in things changed because the "coaching" changed and Norv set up a system that helped the offense succeed. thanks for making my argument for me dude! now dave shula is the president of his daddy's steak house business nowhere near a professional football team. I bet now he can cook up a good steak but then again maybe not, LOL!!!!

its stupid as hell to suggest other players would have done this and that, because it didnt happen, it hadnt and never will, you must be in la la land to think that way, I and most people rather deal with facts and empirical proof rather than what ifs and such I only used the one suggestion to appease you but now looking at it, it was just as stupid as day dreaming all day about stuff that never happened.

as far as the coaching, you have to be an idiot not to get that, coaching and systems have a lot to do with helping a player succeed, or be someone to have never played football other than pee wee, flag football or fantasy...... Originally Posted by TexRich

Oh, I am offering empirical proof, like I said, go look at Troys individual numbers. He's like 20th.
http://www.pro-football-reference.co...reer.htm?redir

Irvin is 17th. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._yards_leaders

The HOF is the best of the best. Not the 23rd and 17th at their position. That OL was the best of the best.

Look at Norvs success elsewhere. You are making my point for me. It was the players.

Other links: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2.../rankings/1-20

20th but how many division titles, conference titles and superbowls and mvps did those other guys win?

how can you rank OL, there are no real stats to rank them?

Norv has had success outside of Dallas and had elevated Philip Rivers play, so I guess youre wrong again dude!