Is “Reverse Jury Nullification” In Play? You Bet It Is.

Why? explain it to me. Originally Posted by texassapper

Please. Do a crime. Do the time. period. The rest is just lip service.

I was really hoping the Classified Documents case was going to be heard this summer. That lying Orange fuck needs to go down for 10 years on that one.... Originally Posted by rooster

Why? explain it to me. Originally Posted by texassapper

Are you serious? Have you paid ANY attention to the charges and the evidence released so far in that case? I mean....other than what Hannity tells you?

37 federal charges, including obstruction and unlawful retention of defense information.

I'm lovin the way he and his taint-lickers are misrepresenting the "FBI had orders to assassinate me!" bullshit.

.

37 federal charges, including obstruction and unlawful retention of defense information. Originally Posted by rooster

Charges don't mean shit... you realize that right?

These are politically motivated prosecutions and so the fact that they exist is meaningless.

The polls show that everyone, even mid-wit democrats, sees through this.

Why don't you explain the crime? I already understand it. And to understand it means to understand that the charges are BS and any conviction will be overturned on appeal.... count on it.

I'm asking if YOU can articulate the crime that you are so sure that Trump is guilty of in the Manhattan trial.

Charges don't mean shit... you realize that right?

These are politically motivated prosecutions and so the fact that they exist is meaningless.

The polls show that everyone, even mid-wit democrats, sees through this.

Why don't you explain the crime? I already understand it. And to understand it means to understand that the charges are BS and any conviction will be overturned on appeal.... count on it.

I'm asking if YOU can articulate the crime that you are so sure that Trump is guilty of in the Manhattan trial. Originally Posted by texassapper

Are you intentionally this obtuse? Cuz I don't understand your nonsensical argument, implying that I need to further "explain" this to validate my views.

Why don't I "explain the crime?" How THE FUCK does that mean I don't understand this? I'm pretty sure I do. And did explain it. In brief, simple terms. Sorry if you could not follow....

But....of course!....you understand it! Then go on to prove it by repeating a bunch of simplistic tropes and bullshit from your FOX and Breitbart mentors.

It ain't a "crime" BTW. It is CRIMES. And they are very clearly laid out in the indictment. Search it using "Case 9:23-cr-80101-AMC" if yer havin trouble finding anything other than Tucker's blog.

If, for some reason, you are still incapable of understanding the charges after reading them, lemme know and I will 'splain it for you further. Yer welcome!

.

To save texass the embarassment of havin to ask me (AGAIN!) to explain the crimes Trump has committed, I will offer a brief synopsis below.

Presented for your enjoyment and edumacation, a Brief History of the "United States vs. Trump, Case 9:23-cr-80101-AMC":

- Government spies write papers about secret things, like recipe for KY Jelly.

- Government marks papers "Secret! Do Not Take!"

- President takes papers home anyway, to read in bathroom.

- President loses election (so they say!)

- EXXX-President makes secret docs into personal ones by reading them while taking a shit.

- Government tells Ex-President "we want papers back pleeze."

- Ex-President tells Government "suck my tiny orange cock"

(Above conversation between EX-Prez and Gov't is repeated 40 times)

- Government says "let's kill Ex-Prez!"

- Ex-Prez leaves town without telling Government.

- Biden's FIB goes to Ex-Prez's house to kill him. They cannot find him. So they take a bunch of his "personal papers."

- Jack Smith says "I'm tired of everyone making fun of my shitty beard. I'm gonna make up some crimes to charge the Ex-Prez!"

- Trump appointed judge sets Trial Date for February 30th, 2066.

And here we are.....

.

To save texass the embarassment of havin to ask me (AGAIN!) to explain the crimes Trump has committed, I will offer a brief synopsis below. Originally Posted by rooster

LOL... well despite the fact this thread is not about THAT particular trial I will just ask one simple question...

who may declassify documents and what is their authority to do so?


I've held TS clearances (they aren't THAT big a deal). One thing is clear though... there ARE authorities that can declassify documents... why don't you explain to the readers who those folks are and from whence they draw their authority.

It's okay if you can't answer it. Jack Smith can't honestly answer it either. That's why we have to wait for SCOTUS to explain it to the 'tards.

LOL... well despite the fact this thread is not about THAT particular trial I will just ask one simple question...

who may declassify documents and what is their authority to do so?


I've held TS clearances (they aren't THAT big a deal). One thing is clear though... there ARE authorities that can declassify documents... why don't you explain to the readers who those folks are and from whence they draw their authority.

It's okay if you can't answer it. Jack Smith can't honestly answer it either. That's why we have to wait for SCOTUS to explain it to the 'tards. Originally Posted by texassapper

I don't know why you are so reluctant to impart your wisdom and inside knowledge of the intelligence community to us poor ignorant whore-mongers. Unless...ya ain't actually got any, other than what you learnt from Boris and Natasha...or the Donald. Even if ya do...I'm worried about yer apparent misunderstanding of your responsibilities.

But PLEASE...'splain to us all how the Prez can declassify a document "just by thinking about it."

I didn't make that up. Or take it out of context. He said that on yer idol Hannity's show.

He also said...on the same show.... that "there doesn't have to be a process."

Hmmmm. Even FOX News seems to disagree, as they show by quoting the NY Times on their own web site (man, that had to sting!):

"Declassifying documents typically follows a process in which the agency to which the information pertains is consulted. Then, an officially designated "original classification authority" would move to declassify the document, according to the New York Times.

While presidents do have the authority to declassify documents on their own, the relevant agencies would still have to be informed of the move for a formal declassification to take place."

I like my idea better, i.e. they are AUTOMATICALLY declassified if he reads them while takin a shit. Makes more sense.

(btw, PLEASE don't think that I use FOX News for "research" on a regular basis....but that sure was interesting!)

Now...let's talk about the real problem here: this cavalier attitude towards "TS" documents and the appropriate clearances required to handle them. And the rules thereof.

Yeah, tons of stuff classified TS is no doubt not deserving of it. It doesn't matter! Rules is rules.

And people like you who thinck this is all just a political attack, who say stoopid shit like TS Clearances aren't "THAT big a deal" are just grasping at straws to try to keep Trump out of Federal prison.

He's a fucking traitor.

But as you said...we'll wait for SCOTUS to 'splain it all. What could go wrong there?

(Personal note of concern: How's Valerie? Is he okay? Mindin the gap?)

You ain't fooolin nobuddy.

.

I don't know why you are so reluctant to impart your wisdom and inside knowledge of the intelligence community to us poor ignorant whore-mongers. Originally Posted by rooster

What inside knowledge do you think holding a TS clearance gave me? The fact that you think it's a BIG deal indicates you don't know shit about the process. TS is as low as you can go in the classification system and still have to have the FBI background check... Every Army officer I've known had it.

Unless...ya ain't actually got any, other than what you learnt from Boris and Natasha...or the Donald. Even if ya do...I'm worried about yer apparent misunderstanding of your responsibilities. Originally Posted by rooster

I'd worry about your blood pressure if I were you.

But PLEASE...'splain to us all how the Prez can declassify a document "just by thinking about it." Originally Posted by rooster

That's for SCOTUS to explain... see you have done some basic research and understand the classifying authority... which branch of our government does that exist under? Who has the ultimate classifying authority in said branch?

I didn't make that up. Or take it out of context. He said that on yer idol Hannity's show. Originally Posted by rooster

Never actually seen a single episode of it... don't have or watch Fox either... your assumptions are as bad as your knowledge

He also said...blah blah blah... While presidents do have the authority to declassify documents on their own, the relevant agencies would still have to be informed of the move for a formal declassification to take place. Originally Posted by rooster

lol thanks for admitting that POTUS has the authority... you understand that just because LTC Snuffy didn't update the file folder, it DOESN'T CHANGE THE DESIGNATION. It's unclassified if POTUS says it is. the rest is simply red tape

Now...let's talk about the real problem here: this cavalier attitude towards "TS" documents and the appropriate clearances required to handle them. And the rules thereof. Originally Posted by rooster

Yeah lets...

Yeah, tons of stuff classified TS is no doubt not deserving of it. It doesn't matter! Rules is rules. Originally Posted by rooster

Are they? LOL.... because I know a certain person who was found in possession of classified documents and he NEVER had the authority to declassify them... care to guess who that might be?

And people like you who thinck this is all just a political attack, who say stoopid shit like TS Clearances aren't "THAT big a deal" are just grasping at straws to try to keep Trump out of Federal prison. Originally Posted by rooster

Now you are REALLY proving you don't know anything about the security process...

He's a fucking traitor. Originally Posted by rooster

Does that make it true of any person that was found in possession of classified documents? Just asking

But as you said...we'll wait for SCOTUS to 'splain it all. What could go wrong there? Originally Posted by rooster

That lefties won't get what they want...

(Personal note of concern: How's Valerie? Is he okay? Mindin the gap?) Originally Posted by rooster

? No clue what you're talking about... Perhaps more aluminum foil would help?

You ain't fooolin nobuddy. Originally Posted by rooster

Yup..you see right through my entire charade. Now perhaps you could focus back on the subject of the thread... you know which had to do with the manhattan trial... you know the only one that is going to complete anytime this year...

lol

What inside knowledge do you think holding a TS clearance gave me?.... Originally Posted by texassapper

Very little, thankfully.

Again, this cavalier attitude, this idea that they are making a big deal out of things that aren't important is....denial.

Your attempts to obfuscate my points with arguments that this is more about semantics and "red tape" are inane.

And your thin reference to "Biden did it too!" is lame AF. It ain't flyin. Cuz you infer that I am a Biden fan, and that I am defending (or ignoring) his mishandling of documents also. Nope. No fan. And not defending him. (It does need to be said that he did not attempt to obstruct the retrieval process in any way close to what Trump and his minions did, though).

Is the prosecution (or as Alina Habba put it...persecution!) of him "selective" and politically motivated? It would be naive to think otherwise. Almost all governmental actions are. SCOTUS gonna give us some more shortly, fer sure. But in this instance, I only care about the end result. End this fucker's political career.

But you got your opinions. I got mine. Trump and whatever lawyers he has left that ain't been indicted got theirs.

Ain't neither of us gonna change the other's. So let's just be straight-forward in our stating them.

Here's mine: Donald Trump is unfit for office. He is a liar and a criminal. He is a massive security risk to this country and our allies. Supporting him is immoral. Your grandchildren will judge you very harshly for it, and they will be baffled by your inability to defend it in a way that makes any sense to them.

Your turn now. I have faith you will come up with something better than "Hey! Stay on topic!"

Please...though...avoid the temptation to do a line-by-line response to every fuggin thing I've said here. That shit is tiresome. A general summary of your disagreements and (more importantly!) your REAL opinions in defending his actions here would be better. Maybe a bit of justification fer why you support one of the worst liars in our political history too (then again....I am assuming that. Maybe you ain't! Let us know!)

You may wanna avoid terms like "lefties" too, IJS. Artful insults and crassness I can appreciate! But terms like that just make ya look cheap(er).

But I'm also gettin kinda bored with this. Ain't gonna play a lot longer. It should just be enough to say "he lies!" and this would all be over. This shit is really gettin old...

(btw...the "Valerie" reference was kinda an iside joke....way inside...to a few that may agree that you remind me of someone)

.

....Maybe a bit of justification fer why you support one of the worst liars in our political history too (then again....I am assuming that. Maybe you ain't! Let us know!)....
. Originally Posted by rooster

Late "Edit Add."

Unfortunately....I ran across some of your other posts. Couldn't miss 'em. You even START threads ta stir up shit. On a hooker board, fer Chrissake. Ya almost seem to be on a mission, maybe consider it's your patriotic duty or sumthin...

So no surprise that my first impressions were correct. You ain't nuthin but a conspiracy theorist troll and Trump shill. Welll...and maybe a "Voluntaryist" too! (whatever TF that is).

I ain't wasting time on you any more. You go ahead and reply to my leftie rant above. Then let's be done with this. You got lotsa other threads that you can impress yer buddies in.

Let me be plain in restating more clearly that I consider opposing Trump to be a MORAL issue. Not a political one. I voted GOP for my entire adult life. He has ruined the party and made them look like unsalvageable fools.

Tell us why you support him. And do it by telling us what is "good" about him. Soooo good that you can support him despite the massive amount of documented lies and his refusal to support the peaceful transfer of power. Don't do it by saying "cuz Joe Biden is crooked and he took speed to stay awake for the State of the Union address."

("GO JOE Juice"?? Really?? The fact that you would even PARTICIPATE in a discussion like that does incredible damage to any credibility you think you may have)

I am sooooo disappointed in myself for being pulled into the absolute morass of ugly horseshit that you and people like "Why_Yes_I_Do" post on a regular basis. I mean...at least ya fuck some whores once in awhile. But still.... you need a life. And some compassion. I post a little of that kind of stuff in a local forum. But nuthin like you boyz. I ain't "goin National" any more, that's for sure. Got more self-respect.

.

texASS did NOT participate in this thread like I charged:

("GO JOE Juice"?? Really?? The fact that you would even PARTICIPATE in a discussion like that does incredible damage to any credibility you think you may have).... Originally Posted by rooster

My apologies to him, and to all of you. I should have been more careful.

If anyone cares...and I don't know why you would....you can find tons of other stuff he has posted that is just as shitty, or worse. But find 'em yerself. I ain't got the stomach for this any more. So much of it is sad, bitter, divisive.

(he does use LOL a lot though! So can't be all bad)

I also apologize to fellow members for bein in this at all. Take a small amount of solace from the likelihood that I will get Mega-points, maybe even a Bancation, fer bein led off on this. Hijacking at minimum, as soon as the Mods take a break from RL on a long weekend. I accept any of it in advance with no protest.

Fuck me.

.

I am sooooo disappointed in myself Originally Posted by rooster

I'm sure you're not the only person you've disappointed in your life.

texassapper,

Trump violated many laws in the Florida document case.

"Trump's indictment has been unsealed. Read the 37 charges brought by federal prosecutors.

A federal grand jury brought criminal charges against former President Donald Trump.

The Justice Department brought the case over Trump taking government records to Mar-a-Lago.

Prosecutors allege Trump broke federal law when he took documents with him from the White House to Mar-a-Lago, rather than leaving them in the hands of the National Archives, which had discovered apparent missing records and sought their return. Some of the records included top-secret national security information.

Of the 37 charges against Trump, 31 are over alleged violations of the Espionage Act for "willful retention of national defense information." Trump also conspired to obstruct justice, lied to law enforcement, and violated three different statutes related to withholding and concealing government records, according to the indictment."

Trump took classified documents with him when he left the White House as EX-PRESIDENT. When asked to return the documents he returned some of them. He then ignored a subpeona requesting the return of the remaining documents. Only when it was clear that Trump would not return the documents was his home entered to retrieve the documents, at which time the documents were found in unsecured locations in Trump's home.

It is also alleged that Trump shared information in classified documents with others who were obviously not cleared to know their contents.

As for Trump being able to declassify documents:

"Most national security legal experts dismissed the former president’s suggestion that he could declassify documents simply by thinking about it. But as an ABA Legal Fact Check posted Oct. 17 explains, legal guidelines support his contention that presidents have broad authority to formally declassify most documents that are not statutorily protected, while they are in office.

The system of classifying national security documents is largely a bureaucratic process used by the federal government to control how executive branch officials handle information, whose release could cause the country harm. The government has, however, prosecuted cases for both mistaken and deliberate mishandling of information. Under the U.S. Constitution, the president as commander in chief is given broad powers to classify and declassify such information, often through use of executive orders.

In all cases, however, a formal procedure is required so governmental agencies know with certainty what has been declassified and decisions memorialized. A federal appeals court in a 2020 Freedom of Information Act case, New York Times v. CIA, underscored that point: “Declassification cannot occur unless designated officials follow specified procedures,” the court said.

As the new ABA Legal Fact Check notes, the extent of a president’s legal authority to unilaterally declassify materials — without following formal procedures — has yet to be challenged in court."

https://www.americanbar.org/news/aba...ial-authority/

As it stands today, Trump was unable to declassify documents without going through well defined procedures. And the fact seems to be that he was an ex-president when he claims to have declassified the documents. Without a formal procedure for declassifying documents no one would truly know what documents were classified and which were not.

And even if the documents were declassified:

"After the FBI searched his Mar-a-Lago home and retrieved boxes of documents — some of them labeled “top secret” — former President Donald Trump released a statement claiming that as president, he had a “standing order … that documents removed from the Oval Office and taken to the residence were deemed to be declassified the moment he removed them.

Numerous experts on national security and the law surrounding classified documents say that isn’t plausible. And in any case, whether some of the documents are classified — as many of them were marked — may be irrelevant to the criminal investigation, since none of the three criminal laws cited as the predicate for the search warrant require documents to be classified for a violation to occur."

Fortunately for Trump the judge handling the case, who was appointed by Trump, has made several controversial decisions in Trump's favor which will probably delay the case until after the election, at which time Trump, if he wins, will dismiss the case, a case in which in my opinion he is guilty as charged.

I'm sure you're not the only person you've disappointed in your life. Originally Posted by texassapper

True. Does your hubris prevent you from saying the same of yerself?

texassapper,

Trump violated many laws in the Florida document case.... Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

Thanks speedie.

Yer even "wordier" than me, but you handle yourself well. Somehow you call bullshit while still remaining civil. I commend you for a skill that I lack.

I'm gonna leave this be now.

It ain't fun any more.

texASS's only valid point...other than the one above.... wuz that I shoulda stayed on topic. I am stoopider because of this thread.

.

Did you forget the part where Bill lied under oath in a civil trial brought by Paula Jones? Believe all women unless they are talking about a democrat.

That's why he was impeached Originally Posted by texassapper

WHA?!?! He nailed Paula running for/in office as POTUS!?!?! Man! Where do I sign up to get trim like that?

When it comes down to it this is very similar to what’s happening to Trump right now, Being prosecuted for covering up a sexual indiscretion.

Like Clinton the crime is the cover-up not the actual act itself. Originally Posted by txdot-guy

Where a guy likes to stick his schlong ain't my business, unless it is an abomination involving something outside his genus/phila (sp). There was a former Housing Secretary that gave up his office because the FBI found out he was paying a mistress. I thought that was kinda unfair but concluded "If it's the law, it's the law." Old Henry Cisneros found out and he didn't raise a stink.
Funny how those who support the party of law and order do everything they can to break such.

LOL... well despite the fact this thread is not about THAT particular trial I will just ask one simple question...

who may declassify documents and what is their authority to do so?


I've held TS clearances (they aren't THAT big a deal). One thing is clear though... there ARE authorities that can declassify documents... why don't you explain to the readers who those folks are and from whence they draw their authority.

It's okay if you can't answer it. Jack Smith can't honestly answer it either. That's why we have to wait for SCOTUS to explain it to the 'tards. Originally Posted by texassapper

Oh. So it is greenlighted in blabbing state secrets at personal parties to foreigners whose pocket you are in than?

The great majority of people I know who hold such clearances you speak of and those that I know worked in various intelligence agencies disagree with you.