Romney Is Still Mad at Trump

I'm not running around claiming to be a financial genius.
Originally Posted by WTF

yeah huh you were

well maybe not running, waddling perhaps

but you were claiming the financial genius of the age status in your oil threads for the last several weeks

although all your oil threads seem interminable and much longer than a few weeks

yeah huh you were

well maybe not running, waddling perhaps

but you were claiming the financial genius of the age status in your oil threads for the last several weeks

although all your oil threads seem interminable and much longer than a few weeks Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

Those threads were about the ignorance of just what energy independence truly meant for most of you. Not to highlight my energy investing prowess.

Let's see you try running a casino in New Frick'n Jersey, especially Atlantic City. If there is one place on earth that is more corrupt and morally bankrupt than the Demonicrat party it is Atlantic City NJ, followed closely by Ukraine - all of which are tied to the Demonicrat party. Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

That is nothing more than excusing Trumps horrible business acumen or total lack of research on your part...or just plain ignorance.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/12/n...rom%20%251%24s


Mr. Trump told the commission in 1988 that he could rein in expenses, because conventional lenders were lining up to give him money at low interest rates. He said he abhorred junk bonds, which were then popular, because they carried a bigger risk of default and thus came with higher interest rates.

Within months, he reversed course, issuing $675 million worth of junk bonds, with a 14 percent interest rate, to finish construction and get the Taj open. In recent interviews, Mr. Trump has said that with each financing he routinely took money out of the casinos to invest in Manhattan real estate. Total debt on the Taj exceeded $820 million.

Less than two weeks before the casino opened, Marvin B. Roffman, a casino analyst at Janney Montgomery Scott, an investment firm based in Philadelphia, told The Wall Street Journal that the Taj would need to reap $1.3 million a day just to make its interest payments, a sum no casino had ever achieved.

“The market just isn’t there,” Mr. Roffman told The Journal.

Mr. Trump retaliated, demanding that Janney Montgomery Scott fire Mr. Roffman. It did.

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“It was doomed way before the start,” said W. Bucky Howard, who was promoted by Mr. Trump to president of the Taj five days after it opened, in a recent interview. “I told him it was going to fail. The Taj was underfunded.”

Almost immediately, Mr. Trump had trouble making the debt payments on the Taj and his other casinos. It was also clear that the Taj was cannibalizing the Castle and the Plaza, whose combined gambling revenues dropped by $58 million the year it opened.

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After more than tripling as new casinos opened through the 1980s, gambling revenues in Atlantic City flattened in 1990, rising by just 1.35 percent, as gamblers grew more cautious in light of a national recession. All were hurt, recalled Mr. Perskie, the casino regulator, but none were in the catastrophic financial shape of Mr. Trump’s.

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At the same time, Mr. Trump’s real estate empire in Manhattan, where the recession cut property values, was also failing.

Image
In April 1990, Mr. Trump officially opened the $1 billion Trump Taj Mahal.
In April 1990, Mr. Trump officially opened the $1 billion Trump Taj Mahal.Credit...Mike Derer/Associated Press
In an August 1990 report, New Jersey regulators noted the “sheer volume of debt” on Mr. Trump’s holdings: $3.4 billion, including $1.3 billion on the casinos and $832.5 million in loans personally guaranteed by Mr. Trump. Regulators warned then that “the possibility of a complete financial collapse of the Trump Organization was not out of the question.”

The Taj Mahal missed its November debt payment. The Castle was also late.

By December 1990, when Mr. Trump needed to make an $18.4 million interest payment, his father, Fred C. Trump, sent a lawyer to the Castle to buy $3.3 million in chips, to provide him with an infusion of cash. The younger Mr. Trump made the payment, but the Casino Control Commission fined the Castle $65,000 for what had amounted to an illegal loan.

As all of his ventures neared collapse, Mr. Trump’s lenders insisted that he submit a business plan, appoint a chief financial officer for the Trump Organization and sell, among other things, the Trump Shuttle airline, his yacht and his stake in New York City’s Plaza Hotel, which also filed for bankruptcy protection. They also put him on a $450,000-a-month budget for personal and household expenses.

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Continue reading the main story

Just over a year after it opened, the Taj Mahal was in bankruptcy court, followed in 1992 by both the Plaza and the Castle. In the plan that was worked out, Mr. Trump ceded to the lenders a 50 percent stake in the businesses in return for lower interest rates. The lenders agreed to defer certain principal and interest payments and hold off on personal claims against Mr. Trump for five years. But there was little or no reduction in the enormous debts that would plague his gambling empire far into the future.

Mr. Trump now says he looks back on the period as his golden era in the casino business.

“Early on, I took a lot of money out of the casinos with the financings and the things we do,” he said in a recent interview. “Atlantic City was a very good cash cow for me for a long time.”

Others were hurt.

“He helped expand Atlantic City, but he just did not put the equity into the projects he should have to keep them solvent,” said H. Steven Norton, a casino consultant and a former casino executive at Resorts International. “When he went bankrupt, he not only cost bondholders money, but he hurt a lot of small businesses that helped him construct the Taj Mahal.”

Beth Rosser of West Chester, Pa., is still bitter over what happened to her father, whose company Triad Building Specialties nearly collapsed when Mr. Trump took the Taj into bankruptcy. It took three years to recover any money owed for his work on the casino, she said, and her father received only 30 cents on the dollar.

You need to recalibrate your numbers...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danalex...h=3498a86c1c48 Originally Posted by WTF

you need to read what you link to


In order to fairly measure Trump against the S&P 500, you need to answer three questions: how much the former president received from his dad, when he received that money and what he is worth now. Around 2016, several outlets tried to make the comparison without knowing those answers, leading to bad guesses that fueled years of inaccurate speculation. On October 2, 2018, the New York Times clarified the picture, addressing the first two questions with a single line buried inside a 13,000-word exposé on the tax returns of Fred Trump, Donald’s dad. “Here is what can be said with certainty,” the article stated. “Had [Donald] Trump done nothing but invest the money his father gave him in an index fund that tracks the Standard & Poor’s 500, he would be worth $1.96 billion today.”


At the time, Forbes estimated that Trump was worth $3.1 billion. In other words, despite all of the speculation to the contrary, he had apparently outperformed the market index by about $1 billion, as of 2018. That accomplishment didn’t get anywhere near as much coverage as the previous suggestions that Trump had underperformed the market.


Trump continued to stay comfortably ahead of the S&P 500 until last year, when Covid turned the world upside down. The stock market tanked, and Trump personally lost an estimated $1 billion in a matter of weeks. After the initial shock, the overall market began to recover, but Trump’s fortune languished. With his hotels, storefronts and office buildings hollowed out, the S&P 500 started to catch up to Trump. Eventually, in early 2021, the market overtook the mogul for good.


thank you valued poster!

I'm not running around claiming to be a financial genius.

Although it was genius how he fucked investors out of their money. Originally Posted by WTF

we knew that before hand ... bahahahhaaaaa


what you won't say is that all of Atlantic City tanked too. Trump got into that game at the wrong time. Trump's casinos were only 4 of almost two dozen that closed during that time. all for the same reason .. too many casinos .. economic downturn .. and no customers with money to lose.


what is also not mentioned is that Trump's Las Vegas properties have been very profitable to him. the timing was better for those investments.

Those threads were about the ignorance of just what energy independence truly meant for most of you. Not to highlight my energy investing prowess. Originally Posted by WTF

if you say so

That is nothing more than excusing Trumps horrible business acumen or total lack of research on your part...or just plain ignorance.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/12/n...rom%20%251%24s


Mr. Trump told the commission in 1988 that he could rein in expenses, because conventional lenders were lining up to give him money at low interest rates. He said he abhorred junk bonds, which were then popular, because they carried a bigger risk of default and thus came with higher interest rates.

Within months, he reversed course, issuing $675 million worth of junk bonds, with a 14 percent interest rate, to finish construction and get the Taj open. In recent interviews, Mr. Trump has said that with each financing he routinely took money out of the casinos to invest in Manhattan real estate. Total debt on the Taj exceeded $820 million.

Less than two weeks before the casino opened, Marvin B. Roffman, a casino analyst at Janney Montgomery Scott, an investment firm based in Philadelphia, told The Wall Street Journal that the Taj would need to reap $1.3 million a day just to make its interest payments, a sum no casino had ever achieved.

“The market just isn’t there,” Mr. Roffman told The Journal.

Mr. Trump retaliated, demanding that Janney Montgomery Scott fire Mr. Roffman. It did.

ADVERTISEMENT

Continue reading the main story

“It was doomed way before the start,” said W. Bucky Howard, who was promoted by Mr. Trump to president of the Taj five days after it opened, in a recent interview. “I told him it was going to fail. The Taj was underfunded.”

Almost immediately, Mr. Trump had trouble making the debt payments on the Taj and his other casinos. It was also clear that the Taj was cannibalizing the Castle and the Plaza, whose combined gambling revenues dropped by $58 million the year it opened.

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March 30, 2022
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March 30, 2022
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March 30, 2022
Soda and Beer Companies Are Ditching Plastic Six-Pack Rings
March 30, 2022
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After more than tripling as new casinos opened through the 1980s, gambling revenues in Atlantic City flattened in 1990, rising by just 1.35 percent, as gamblers grew more cautious in light of a national recession. All were hurt, recalled Mr. Perskie, the casino regulator, but none were in the catastrophic financial shape of Mr. Trump’s.

ADVERTISEMENT

Continue reading the main story

At the same time, Mr. Trump’s real estate empire in Manhattan, where the recession cut property values, was also failing.

Image
In April 1990, Mr. Trump officially opened the $1 billion Trump Taj Mahal.
In April 1990, Mr. Trump officially opened the $1 billion Trump Taj Mahal.Credit...Mike Derer/Associated Press
In an August 1990 report, New Jersey regulators noted the “sheer volume of debt” on Mr. Trump’s holdings: $3.4 billion, including $1.3 billion on the casinos and $832.5 million in loans personally guaranteed by Mr. Trump. Regulators warned then that “the possibility of a complete financial collapse of the Trump Organization was not out of the question.”

The Taj Mahal missed its November debt payment. The Castle was also late.

By December 1990, when Mr. Trump needed to make an $18.4 million interest payment, his father, Fred C. Trump, sent a lawyer to the Castle to buy $3.3 million in chips, to provide him with an infusion of cash. The younger Mr. Trump made the payment, but the Casino Control Commission fined the Castle $65,000 for what had amounted to an illegal loan.

As all of his ventures neared collapse, Mr. Trump’s lenders insisted that he submit a business plan, appoint a chief financial officer for the Trump Organization and sell, among other things, the Trump Shuttle airline, his yacht and his stake in New York City’s Plaza Hotel, which also filed for bankruptcy protection. They also put him on a $450,000-a-month budget for personal and household expenses.

ADVERTISEMENT

Continue reading the main story

Just over a year after it opened, the Taj Mahal was in bankruptcy court, followed in 1992 by both the Plaza and the Castle. In the plan that was worked out, Mr. Trump ceded to the lenders a 50 percent stake in the businesses in return for lower interest rates. The lenders agreed to defer certain principal and interest payments and hold off on personal claims against Mr. Trump for five years. But there was little or no reduction in the enormous debts that would plague his gambling empire far into the future.

Mr. Trump now says he looks back on the period as his golden era in the casino business.

“Early on, I took a lot of money out of the casinos with the financings and the things we do,” he said in a recent interview. “Atlantic City was a very good cash cow for me for a long time.”

Others were hurt.

“He helped expand Atlantic City, but he just did not put the equity into the projects he should have to keep them solvent,” said H. Steven Norton, a casino consultant and a former casino executive at Resorts International. “When he went bankrupt, he not only cost bondholders money, but he hurt a lot of small businesses that helped him construct the Taj Mahal.”

Beth Rosser of West Chester, Pa., is still bitter over what happened to her father, whose company Triad Building Specialties nearly collapsed when Mr. Trump took the Taj into bankruptcy. It took three years to recover any money owed for his work on the casino, she said, and her father received only 30 cents on the dollar. Originally Posted by WTF

TL/DR wtf who cares yes i said so DAH!


BAAAAHHHAAAAAAAAAAA

I understand where you're coming from. Romney sometimes comes across as flaky and flip-floppy. But I don't think his 2016 criticism of Trump was designed to make him look brave. I think he was genuinely offended - not by Trump's policy views, but by his style.

Trump is his own worst enemy. He doesn't have a filter. He doesn't know when to bite his tongue. So he alienates as many people as he attracts. Why attack Meryl Streep or tweet about Mika Brzezynski's bleeding facelift as President? What useful purpose is served, other than signaling to everyone how thin-skinned, boorish and insecure you are? Let your fucking staff attack dogs do that shit. Trump didn't start the race to the bottom in our politics, but he didn't do anything to lift us out of the gutter either. Originally Posted by lustylad

it was unrealistic to expect Trump to change his ways. he is who he is, for better or worse. would it have benefited his prospects as president to tone down the rhetoric? certainly as it only gave more fodder to the press to yell and scream their woke bs about him.


as far as Romney goes, their styles could hardly be more different. Trump is brash and boisterous, Romney almost demur to express himself. calculated like a perfect politico in his responses.


and just so our far leftist friends here know, i voted for Romney and he would have been far better than that unqualified in over his head racist punk Muslim America hating gaytard Obama.


and if Romney had been more critical of Obama he might have won. Trump was right to claim Romney didn't attack Obama's obvious shortcomings as president enough.

You need to recalibrate your numbers...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danalex...h=3498a86c1c48 Originally Posted by WTF

you need to read what you link to


With his hotels, storefronts and office buildings hollowed out, the S&P 500 started to catch up to Trump. Eventually, in early 2021, the market overtook the mogul for good.


thank you valued poster!






we
BAAAAHHHAAAAAAAAAAA Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

I read the linked. As I said....lustylad needed to recalibrate....because as you highlighted. The market overtook the Mogul.

Do you understand what recalibrate means?

I read the linked. As I said....lustylad needed to recalibrate....because as you highlighted. The Chinese COVID overtook the Mogul.

Do you understand what recalibrate means? Originally Posted by WTF

ftfy professor poofter

Trumpy is still mad at everybody dah

Example of a Republican that is spineless.

None can stand up to Trump. The GOP is being destroyed. Originally Posted by VitaMan

No. the GOP you know no longer exist. it was destroyed 4 years ago when they suicided against trump.

https://eccie.net/showpost.php?p=1062794977&postcount=1

romney is part of the neocon faction. people like graham and the late mccain need to be purged out of d.c. i believe Rubio is one of them.



the neocons had conned a quite a good number of them. ia

As I said....lustylad needed to recalibrate.... Originally Posted by WTF

Bend over, poofter!

poofter


Brit/Aussie slang for a male homosexual, based on the permanant stretching of the anus that results from repeated anal sex, which causes farts to be emitted with a "pooft" sound rather than the usual, stacatto "bra-a-a-p".

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=poofter

romney is part of the neocon faction. people like graham and the late mccain need to be purged out of d.c. i believe Rubio is one of them.



the neocons had conned a quite a good number of them. ia Originally Posted by dilbert firestorm

That would be my one and only big criticism of Romney. But unlike McCain and Graham, you can't really tell from his history if he would implement the neocon agenda if elected president. He hasn't spent half his life in Congress like those two.

When Romney was running for president, Robert Zoellick was his national security advisor and proposed transition advisor. This pissed off the neocons, because Zoellick was from the Ronald Reagan / George H. W. Bush school. You go in and you kick ass when you need to, in Grenada or Kuwait or whatever, and then you leave. You don't try to nation build. Or at least that's what I'm getting from reading a couple of articles I found through Google. Anyway if people like Zoellick had positions in his administration and he followed their advice, he probably wouldn't have been considered a neocon.

it was unrealistic to expect Trump to change his ways. Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

So they voted for Bitten/Kumola?

What I saw/heard about their whining is ...

... they didn't like him to "tweet"! "UnPresidential"!!!

#1 How would "they" know? #2: Look what they wanted ....

That would be my one and only big criticism of Romney. Originally Posted by Tiny

Are you still "masking" to stay well?

.