Fiscal Cliff Deal Reached!

Yssup Rider's Avatar
Yeah. I lied. Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy
Now you're lying about that!

and BTW -- am I wrong, but aren't these horrendous tax increases just returning some people to the level of taxation they were at before the Bush tax cuts flushed it economy down the toilet?

and also BTW -- they didn't even deal with spending cuts, which trigger in two months unless some new deal is struck?

BTW -- wouldn't that make Whiny's math fuzzier than his ears?
joe bloe's Avatar
Spending is the problem, not taxation. I sincerely doubt there will be any real spending cuts. Republicans will cave on that, too. Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy
It's like being on an airplane that's gone into a dive. The passengers keep thinking the pilot's going pull out of the dive. Then it dawns on them he's going to take the plane into the ground at full speed and not even attempt to pull up. That's America. Obama is about to crash the system and he's doing it on purpose.
Yssup Rider's Avatar
and BTW -- the House GOP punished Christie tonight by squashing the aid bill for Sandy. NO SOUP FOR YOUSE!
joe bloe's Avatar
and BTW -- the House GOP punished Christie tonight by squashing the aid bill for Sandy. NO SOUP FOR YOUSE! Originally Posted by Yssup Rider
It might do him some good to cut back on the soup.
CuteOldGuy's Avatar
and BTW -- the House GOP punished Christie tonight by squashing the aid bill for Sandy. NO SOUP FOR YOUSE! Originally Posted by Yssup Rider
The word is "quash", idiot. Every post you show how stupid you are.
Chica Chaser's Avatar
Those spending cuts won't materialize, in two months or two years.
Yssup Rider's Avatar
Hey joe hard, you continually accuse POTUS of intentionally trying to destroy America. Why don't you offer more than your paranoid pipe dreams to back that up? You're almost as tedious as the Unaliar.

Squash works, whiny. Look it up. So does abandon. So does piss on NJ. You're just grasping at straws. But at least you played the idiot card with me, which is your default comeback...

Predictable. Tedious. Untruthful. Self flagellant.
Chica Chaser's Avatar
FYI, here is a synopsis of the new law

--Income tax rates: Extends decade-old tax cuts on incomes up to $400,000 for individuals, $450,000 for couples. Earnings above those amounts would be taxed at a rate of 39.6 percent, up from the current 35 percent. Extends Clinton-era caps on itemized deductions and the phase-out of the personal exemption for individuals making more than $250,000 and couples earning more than $300,000.
--Estate tax: Estates would be taxed at a top rate of 40 percent, with the first $5 million in value exempted for individual estates and $10 million for family estates. In 2012, such estates were subject to a top rate of 35 percent.
--Capital gains, dividends: Taxes on capital gains and dividend income exceeding $400,000 for individuals and $450,000 for families would increase from 15 percent to 20 percent.
--Alternative minimum tax: Permanently addresses the alternative minimum tax and indexes it for inflation to prevent nearly 30 million middle- and upper-middle income taxpayers from being hit with higher tax bills averaging almost $3,000. The tax was originally designed to ensure that the wealthy did not avoid owing taxes by using loopholes.
--Other tax changes: Extends for five years Obama-sought expansions of the child tax credit, the earned income tax credit, and an up-to-$2,500 tax credit for college tuition. Also extends for one year accelerated "bonus" depreciation of business investments in new property and equipment, a tax credit for research and development costs and a tax credit for renewable energy such as wind-generated electricity.
--Unemployment benefits: Extends jobless benefits for the long-term unemployed for one year.
--Cuts in Medicare reimbursements to doctors: Blocks a 27 percent cut in Medicare payments to doctors for one year. The cut is the product of an obsolete 1997 budget formula.
--Social Security payroll tax cut: Allows a 2-percentage-point cut in the payroll tax first enacted two years ago to lapse, which restores the payroll tax to 6.2 percent.
--Across-the-board cuts: Delays for two months $109 billion worth of across-the-board spending cuts set to start striking the Pentagon and domestic agencies this week. Cost of $24 billion is divided between spending cuts and new revenues from rule changes on converting traditional individual retirement accounts into Roth IRAs.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013...fiscal-crisis/

Plus the requisite pork/payoffs, of course
Under the plan, the federal government would eat nearly $100 billion in forgone tax revenue over the next two years by extending special tax credits for select businesses that had been set to expire.
Including:
--$430 million for Hollywood through “special expensing rules” to encourage ----TV and film production in the United States. Producers can expense up to ---$15 million of costs for their projects.
--$331 million for railroads by allowing short-line and regional operators to claim a tax credit up to 50 percent of the cost to maintain tracks that they own or lease.
--$222 million for Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands through returned excise taxes collected by the federal government on rum produced in the islands and imported to the mainland.
--$70 million for NASCAR by extending a “7-year cost recovery period for certain motorsports racing track facilities.”
--$59 million for algae growers through tax credits to encourage production of “cellulosic biofuel” at up to $1.01 per gallon.
--$4 million for electric motorcycle makers by expanding an existing green-energy tax credit for buyers of plug-in vehicles to include electric motorbikes.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics...rum-producers/
It's amazing to me that so many people seem to consider this some sort of victory. To what level of irresponsibility must Congress rise for some of you guys to register disapproval? Of course, these clowns abrogated their responsibilty back in the Summer of 2011 when they teed up this fiasco.

The spectacle of a bunch of sleep-deprived octogenarians in the Senate voting at 2 a.m. on New Year's Day is simply ridiculous beyond description.

And one thing that no one has mentioned (at least not in this thread) is that the "$600 billion" tax increase is unlikely to raise anywhere near that much revenue over the next 10 years. The further you go out on the tail of the income distribution, the more of the "anticipated revenue" simply pulls a disappearing act. That's due to some particulars of how our tax code works in practice. Of course, that doesn't really matter much to most politicians. This fraud is obviously much more about scoring a political victory than it is about enacting sound, sustainable economic policy.

And it was just the first episode in a series of political standoffs and crises. It's time to start teeing up the next one.

Expect plenty of chaos over the next year or two!
  • TPJR
  • 01-02-2013, 11:27 AM
There's a lot of blame that is rightfully aimed at Congress, but 1 thing people fail to realize is that "we the people" deserve probably as much blame as well. The fact is that these Congressmen and women didn't elect themselves into office; We did. This is what happens when people vote base on partisan demagogery and ignorance. This is the government we deserve.
WTF's Avatar
  • WTF
  • 01-02-2013, 11:55 AM
There's a lot of blame that is rightfully aimed at Congress, but 1 thing people fail to realize is that "we the people" deserve probably as much blame as well. The fact is that these Congressmen and women didn't elect themselves into office; We did. This is what happens when people vote base on partisan demagogery and ignorance. This is the government we deserve. Originally Posted by TPJR
Chica Chaser's Avatar
It's amazing to me that so many people seem to consider this some sort of victory. To what level of irresponsibility must Congress rise for some of you guys to register disapproval? Of course, these clowns abrogated their responsibilty back in the Summer of 2011 when they teed up this fiasco.

The spectacle of a bunch of sleep-deprived octogenarians in the Senate voting at 2 a.m. on New Year's Day is simply ridiculous beyond description.

And one thing that no one has mentioned (at least not in this thread) is that the "$600 billion" tax increase is unlikely to raise anywhere near that much revenue over the next 10 years. The further you go out on the tail of the income distribution, the more of the "anticipated revenue" simply pulls a disappearing act. That's due to some particulars of how our tax code works in practice. Of course, that doesn't really matter much to most politicians. This fraud is obviously much more about scoring a political victory than it is about enacting sound, sustainable economic policy.

And it was just the first episode in a series of political standoffs and crises. It's time to start teeing up the next one.

Expect plenty of chaos over the next year or two! Originally Posted by CaptainMidnight
Cappy

Lets not worry though, they are going to get around to the real spending cuts...in a couple months. With a new congress.
CuteOldGuy's Avatar
This is in the "fiscal cliff" bill? Does NASCAR need corporate welfare? I guess so.

The "fiscal cliff" deal reached by the Senate and the White House on New Year's Eve, and passed in legislative form by the Senate early New Year's Day, includes many giveaways to special interests--including an extension of a perk enjoyed by "motorsports entertainment complexes" otherwise known as the "NASCAR tax credit."

The provision, under section 168(i)(15) of the federal tax code, allows speedways to write off their costs over seven years. Typically, such expensing occurs over a much longer period of time, from 15 to 39 years. The cost of the NASCAR tax credit to taxpayers has been estimated at some $40 million--over and above any tax incentives provided by state and local authorities.
Hollywood films also enjoy a tax incentive extension in the "fiscal cliff" deal. The 157-page bill may grow yet larger--and more lucrative for special interests--as the House adds amendments.


http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-S...CAR-Tax-Credit
CuteOldGuy's Avatar
But wait! There's more!

The “fiscal cliff” compromise has been heralded as a saving grace for middle class taxpayers, their families and the unemployed.

But buried in the fine print of the 150-page deal are also some lesser-known New Year’s gifts to some of Washington’s favorite industries.
Under the plan, the federal government would eat nearly $100 billion in forgone tax revenue over the next two years by extending special tax credits for select businesses that had been set to expire.

While the provisions themselves are not new, and are often extended as part of major bills, their inclusion amidst a tumultuous year-end debate over deficits and debt did raise a few eyebrows.

The nonpartisan Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget listed the so-called “tax extenders” as a “bad” part of the fiscal cliff deal because their cost is not offset, “setting a bad precedent for future extensions.”

The mix of tax perks covering the next year, but with budget implications for the next two years includes everything from incentives for employers to hire veterans to incentives for employers to invest in mine safety. But it also includes these:

$430 million for Hollywood through “special expensing rules” to encourage TV and film production in the United States. Producers can expense up to $15 million of costs for their projects.

$331 million for railroads by allowing short-line and regional operators to claim a tax credit up to 50 percent of the cost to maintain tracks that they own or lease.

$222 million for Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands through returned excise taxes collected by the federal government on rum produced in the islands and imported to the mainland.

$70 million for NASCAR by extending a “7-year cost recovery period for certain motorsports racing track facilities.”

$59 million for algae growers through tax credits to encourage production of “cellulosic biofuel” at up to $1.01 per gallon.

$4 million for electric motorcycle makers by expanding an existing green-energy tax credit for buyers of plug-in vehicles to include electric motorbikes.

*Note the price tags above reflect estimated forgone tax revenue if current credits – which have been due to expire – are extended for one year as included in the Senate bill, per Joint Committee on Taxation.


Are you kidding me? I thought this was about "responsible fiscal policy"?

Does Hollywood need a tax break? NASCAR? Rum producers? Algae growers? Seriously, algae growers? Electric motorcycle makers?

This is your Congress. Your tax dollars (and you children's and grandchildren's) at work. They should be ashamed.

They created the problem, then they congratulate each other when they "fix it." What a bunch of bullshitting liars.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics...rum-producers/
This is in the "fiscal cliff" bill? Does NASCAR need corporate welfare? I guess so.

The "fiscal cliff" deal reached by the Senate and the White House on New Year's Eve, and passed in legislative form by the Senate early New Year's Day, includes many giveaways to special interests--including an extension of a perk enjoyed by "motorsports entertainment complexes" otherwise known as the "NASCAR tax credit."

The provision, under section 168(i)(15) of the federal tax code, allows speedways to write off their costs over seven years. Typically, such expensing occurs over a much longer period of time, from 15 to 39 years. The cost of the NASCAR tax credit to taxpayers has been estimated at some $40 million--over and above any tax incentives provided by state and local authorities.
Hollywood films also enjoy a tax incentive extension in the "fiscal cliff" deal. The 157-page bill may grow yet larger--and more lucrative for special interests--as the House adds amendments.

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-S...CAR-Tax-Credit Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy
I read all of this crap this morning, and it just makes your blood boil.
And I am a big NASCAR fan.
What in the hell are we doing subsidizing any for profit organization, much less one that reaps in millions.