Now hiring for Sugar Daddy:)

Conceptually I think the biggest difference is that a SB/SD that starts from a non provider does not start with the girl thinking, how much do I need to make this work. A provider starts with how much do I need to make this work.

If you don't like being manipulated you have a far less chance of being manipulated by by someone that is younger, not in this world and not looking at the almighty dollar as the driving factor. Maybe like pleasantsurprise they enjoy older men, the have a taste for things they can't afford etc.... so it appeals to them.

In college I dated many beautiful women and part of allure was what I was going to be in life for some. So they looked at me as person with good potential. I didn't make shit for money. Now take a young lady that might be attracted to an older more sophisticated guy that has taken care of himself. and there is no thought of how much is this worth to me to this. It simply is a cool thing, that then starts turning into a financial relationship, because the guy wants to help her and enjoys someone that appreciates even simple things. Then they start spending more money because they want to. The thought of how I work this type of arrangement around my real life and what complications could arise worry me to a degree.

Now take a provider who starts out with what is in it for me financially? This is where they start. So from the beginning it feels less organic, more of a business deal. Maybe as some have stated a hooker on retainer. This type of situation it less likely to have any kind of emotional element that is part of the other scenario. but it could develop I guess.

Many fail to address the emotional element of these type of relationships as part of the process and unless you do that it is hard for a guy to see how a provider fits in that equation. Lets face it is almost the opposite for most guys who hobby, they want to see a provider to remove the emotional aspect of sex and closeness and go back their real life.

You said it perfectly.

Nothing more needed

I added my perspective below, in magenta.
It isn't intended to be looked at as if correcting you, but just how it appears to me.

A sugar daddy would not have you quit a job
...unless the job is escorting.

A man who believes it's his way or the highway, such as
A sugar daddy would tell you there is no time for us to be together and it wouldn't work out, get his phone out and go "NEXT!"

So that scenario is moot.
G... you told bustyamy, "Yep, when things dont go the way you think say "I made this thread as a joke." But then you turned around and called my scenario "moot."

I tell guys that get UTR hookers to dump them and get a real sugar baby. I would tell the woman or girl to dump him and get a real sugar daddy.
I like these two sentences because you present them as what you do or would do, versus what everyone else should do.

You girls still don't get it but that is expected. <-saying this makes it hard for a person to put their self in your shoes
You see, money comes up first and you are doing the math to see if it is worth it lol.

That is your problem, <-saying this makes it hard for a person to put their self in your shoes that is what stops you, that is what drives you.

You don't let the money drive the relationship. You let the relationship work out and if he is a true sugar daddy then that kind of money is not an issue.

You want a client on retainer and he wants a hooker on one.
If the result is exclusivity and both parties are happy, what interest has the label? Originally Posted by Gotyour6

I'm still trying to figure out:

If a lady is attracted to older men and the finer things/experiences in life,
and she doesn't yet have a SD,
then for what reasons should she quit being a provider?

If a lady is attracted to older men and the finer things/experiences in life,
and she doesn't yet have a SD,
then for what reasons should she quit being a provider? Originally Posted by PleasantSurprise

It would be the same question you would ask if you had a nice paying job, but were tired of it or it was not meeting what you needed. Why would I quit this high paying job to take a chance at a lower paying job? To be fulfilled, to move on to something that may be better, to break the cycle of just punching the clock. There are many reasons why people quit high paying jobs and take on something else. If money is the basic reason why a person stays in a job then most likely they will never try something new.

When you ask they question you have asked, it really confirms to many that say providers do not or cannot make good sugar babies. If you read my post above, it helps explain some things from a different angle, than some have articulated.

Like as in come to me with your money requests and I'll decide if I'm going to pay them or not under the pretext of teaching you how to fish. I see it from the men's side, it wouldn't kill you to at least try to see it from the woman's side. Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

LOL. Do you think I like it when people hit me up for money? You lecture me about not seeing sides, but do you like it when people hit you up for money?

Maybe some guys do get a thrill and a power rush when women hit them up for money. I don't know. I know I don't, and I don't speak for all men, and you don't speak for all women.

And quit playing like attractive women are so helpless. I have been in my SB's closets before who claim to have "no money". What do you think I saw? How many pairs of shoes do you think my average SB has?

The "no money for rent" thing then is not flattery. It is women using their persuasive power to play damsel in distress to sucker men.

And this is the stripper/hooker mentality. There is the belief that men's only worthwhile functions are as sperm donors and ATM machines. You imagine that lying to men for money/fish is met by most other women with a chorus of "you go girl" when it is the exact opposite.

When you ask they question you have asked, it really confirms to many that say providers do not or cannot make good sugar babies. If you read my post above, it helps explain some things from a different angle, than some have articulated. Originally Posted by oktome

We may be getting stuck on absolutes here. I don't believe that providers cannot be good sugar babies, but that most do not because they tend look at their client relationships primarily in a transactional way and not so much emotional or intellectual. Some providers have a RL job and lately I've met a couple who may quit or go UTR, but have gotten in the habit of staying for hours or all night after scheduling a one hour session with me. We drink good wine, talk, go to movies occasionally now. I like them, listen and provide feedback, advice and a sounding board that they do not get in their RL so there is much more of a connection. They treat me nicely and never clock watch and seen unconcerned about time after our scheduled session is past. I can see these ladies transitioning to a real SB relationship fairly easily because their hearts are no longer in the transactional sex for $ biz. They do seem to need/want some additional help and more than that some TLC, emotional support and mentoring to make it without a debilitating struggle (or appreciate it). I don't want to control them and we are friends (though I don't count or expect anything from them at all so far) and I wish them well. Now I'm NOT saying they ARE SBs yet, but I think they could be and may be (one had a SD when she was much younger) at some future point.

IMHO this is unusual, but not impossible. In most SB cases I've seen, had or read about recently, the SB is usually struggling, not in a relationship (maybe she has a BF, but not much of one in most cases) and needs not only financial but other help to make life not such a struggle. She wants and needs a lift over the top and money is not the primary or only consideration. She usually wants and needs sex AND a relationship/an emotional connection and friendly support in many different ways. Something the client/escort relationship almost never has.

If you are talking about $3,4,5, 8K or more a month I think you are generally talking about a mistress. An SB is also a mistress and I'm sure a mistress can be an SB, but the SB relationship is or should be quite a bit more. A mistress can and often is the complete equal (especially BCD) of her partner (archaic: master) while an SB is usually less equal or at least less experienced in many ways. IMHO, most, but not all, providers, would be fools not to want to be a mistress, but a true mistress who is a "kept woman" is fairly few and far between these days. I wish all you ladies good luck in your quest, whatever it is you desire to be when you grow up. Or just don't grow up like me!

I guess the reason I ask the question is because... as a lady who truly enjoys spending time with older men... during the time which there is no SD in the picture, I don't see the logic behind why one/I should discontinue being a provider. With no SD, being a provider seems to be the true win-win scenario for someone who is in heaven when with an older man. I like making men happy. I love intensity. Seeing a man smile fulfills me.

Would I like to have a SD? Yes. Do I currently have one? No. Should I stop being a provider when I love spending time with men 40-50 and up? I'm not sure, because as a provider, the men I see are 1) in my desired age range and 2) at least attracted to me on a physical level. And the on the financial side, I can make ends meet, invest, and etc.

You girls still don't get it but that is expected. You see, money comes up first and you are doing the math to see if it is worth it lol. Originally Posted by Gotyour6

What is ultimately most important? The experience? The emotional attachment? Looks? Money? Connection? If you could only pick one, if one had to apply to everyone, which would it be? Where is the right place to begin?

First attractions….

What first attracts a man to a woman? What causes him to look twice? Is a SD not shallow for searching around and only giving skinny girls a chance? When was the last time you walked up to an obese woman, asking her to be your SB? My only point is looks come up first for men, and after looks meet a certain minimum criteria, then the woman or girl is given a chance.

For women who aren't in a great financial position, yes money is likely to be the first thing on their mind. Is it wrong or bad for a woman to wonder how she is going to pay her bills this month, next month, etc?

For women who are in a great financial position, yes money is likely to be discussed before a decision is made. Is it wrong or bad for a woman to weigh the pro's and con's before deciding to reduce the money coming in over any period of time?

Conceptually I think the biggest difference is that a SB/SD that starts from a non provider does not start with the girl thinking, how much do I need to make this work. A provider starts with how much do I need to make this work.

If you don't like being manipulated you have a far less chance of being manipulated by by someone that is younger, not in this world and not looking at the almighty dollar as the driving factor. Maybe like pleasantsurprise they enjoy older men, the have a taste for things they can't afford etc.... so it appeals to them.

Many fail to address the emotional element of these type of relationships as part of the process and unless you do that it is hard for a guy to see how a provider fits in that equation. Lets face it is almost the opposite for most guys who hobby, they want to see a provider to remove the emotional aspect of sex and closeness and go back their real life. Originally Posted by oktome

How much do I need...

I think all women considering being a SB do ask the question, "How much do I need to make this work?" I think the difference from provider to non-provider is the amount. I think money is the driving factor for a high percentage of SB's. A non-provider SB is just willing to accept a lower amount, but she still does ask the question, "How much do I need to make this work?"

Providers as SB's...

What if before eliminating a provider from the list of SB potentials, a guy/client/SD
-respectfully offered to pay a social rate, visit her X number of times to determine compatibility, and then made a decision from there?
-asked to meet one time, one hour off the clock to determine whether or not the two stood a chance at compatibility?

I think the biggest dispute would circle around a guy taking advantage of a situation, needing more and more time to determine compatibility. If there were less hagglers stretching an inch into a mile, I think more women would be willing to meet potential SD's off the clock a time or two.

I guess the reason I ask the question is because... as a lady who truly enjoys spending time with older men... during the time which there is no SD in the picture, I don't see the logic behind why one/I should discontinue being a provider. Originally Posted by PleasantSurprise

I don't either. I have one SB who is an escort and several who are strippers. You keep limiting yourself with false dilemmas PS. My job or SD? Being an escort or SD? You don't have to be exclusive, and you don't have to do bareback.

I like that you don't look at men as ATMs like most providers, and that is the most important part of being a SB. You are not just a piece of ass, and the man isn't just an ATM.

What you are missing though is the role of SD as mentor. None of us got the finer things in life by being escorts, so there is another path besides us just giving it to you. Of all the advice I have doled out to the SBs I have had, just two have taken what I have said and ran with it. Most just want to be given money instead of earning it.

I gave one of my SBs a job, but she screwed things up, and I had to let her go. I set her up with a friend of mine, and he offered her a job in his telephone business. She turned it down, and he told me, "If she had done things right, she would have made $100,000 per year."

If you were my SB, you would get what you are getting as an escort: the meals, the fancy places, the sex. I'd be shocked though if you didn't have better conversations with me, more fun, and better sex. You would also have more money because you would be keeping your cleaning job and escort job plus what I gave you.

As for what I would expect from you, I really don't have expectations beyond sex and time, but there is probably something in your life that you do well and like/don't mind doing that others consider work: cooking, cleaning, baby sitting whatever. If you are a true SB, you should want to want to do that for me just like you would do it for a friend.

On top of that, you'd possibly benefit from my credit lines, my connections, my assets, my skills, and my knowledge. These could lower your expenses and increase the return on your investments. Instead of your giving money to a financial adviser, I would show you how to be your own financial adviser and how important that is.

And you don't have to move to Dallas, PS. I am sure that you can find a guy and work the same arrangement with a guy up in KC.

LOL. Do you think I like it when people hit me up for money? You lecture me about not seeing sides, but do you like it when people hit you up for money? Originally Posted by woodyboyd

No, but I don’t go around talking about how much I have either.

Maybe some guys do get a thrill and a power rush when women hit them up for money. I don't know. I know I don't, and I don't speak for all men, and you don't speak for all women. Originally Posted by woodyboyd

I think I can easily speak for all but .009% of the women when I say that we don’t like asking for money from anyone. I / we don’t need to be taught life lessons about spending habits from someone that prefers his women helpless.

That said, the life lesson you, along with Gotyour9 and oktome, are teaching about not getting yourself financially subject and subordinate to someone’s whims and control is a very good lesson to teach. Although, I’m sure there is a nicer way to teach the lesson.

And quit playing like attractive women are so helpless. Originally Posted by woodyboyd

This makes me laugh. Of all the women to say this to! LOL, Nice try though.

I have been in my SB's closets before who claim to have "no money". What do you think I saw? How many pairs of shoes do you think my average SB has? Originally Posted by woodyboyd

Here’s the deal wood. I’m a spoiled and pampered woman. I have the finer things in life. I’m not the biggest fan of indiscriminant purchases of shoes, though I probably have seventy-five pair, but suffice it to say I don’t lack on what I need or want. All that said, you know who PAID for all my stuff? Me. I did. All I’ve said from the beginning is that a woman needs her own purse.

The "no money for rent" thing then is not flattery. It is women using their persuasive power to play damsel in distress to sucker men. Originally Posted by woodyboyd

And the scenario you and your compadres are talking about is the converse. Men lording their financial power over someone they are supposed to care about. Go back and read what I said. I said:

The whole SD/SB thing is a power game. Earn your own living ladies and let love flourish where it will and let commerce flourish where it will. When the lines intersect, as they do in any relationship be open about it. Loving someone is the more important thing, but love doesn’t pay the bills. Money isn’t the most important thing in life, but it pays for the two most important things: your health and your family. Respect money not worship or chase it and you’ll be much happier, because in the end, it’s just a brass ring if the money is all you are interested in. End of Story. Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

And this is the stripper/hooker mentality. There is the belief that men's only worthwhile functions are as sperm donors and ATM machines. You imagine that lying to men for money/fish is met by most other women with a chorus of "you go girl" when it is the exact opposite. Originally Posted by woodyboyd

Read what I’ve said. I was a professional companion and that’s an honest living as far as I’m concerned. Since you don’t seem to think that, why are you here since you seem to have a problem with the equation of “You pay me for my time and you get a sure thing”. I never treated my clients like dinero doners, but I never gave anything away either. I’d be surprised if you give anything away in your business either.

I call my blog Hooker Incorporated because hooking, for lack of a better word, is a business – It’s big business actually. That the gentlemen that patronize us don’t realize that is a testimony to how well we do our jobs. For those that hate the mystique of the game, I do a whole tongue and cheek thing about whore-hating whore-mongers.

Now take a young lady that might be attracted to an older more sophisticated guy that has taken care of himself. and there is no thought of how much is this worth to me to this. Originally Posted by oktome

You have GOT to be kidding me right? Think about it. If you’re looking at her like she’s a sweet young thing, in other words, a high value female, then you just HAVE GOT to know she’s sizing you up the same way. That is you are a high value male. Your looks are secondary to some woman twenty years your junior. Trust me.

Then they start spending more money because they want to. The thought of how I work this type of arrangement around my real life and what complications could arise worry me to a degree. Originally Posted by oktome

Either see an escort or find someone to love you for you. But bare in mind, everyone wants the highest value mate they can attract. That law doesn’t change for you or anyone. Unless you pick some wretch to love who will just be grateful to have you, you are being sized up the same way you are sizing up the woman. Period. The End.

You have GOT to be kidding me right? Think about it. If you’re looking at her like she’s a sweet young thing, in other words, a high value female, then you just HAVE GOT to know she’s sizing you up the same way. That is you are a high value male. Your looks are secondary to some woman twenty years your junior. Trust me.y you are sizing up the woman. Period. The End. Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

Sizing me up in what ways. Because I a good hunter and can bring home food. Think about this for a second. If what you say is true and I know from your perspective it is, why is it then that young females in this business are often around men who make more, are better educated, and in higher levels of society don't immediately drop their babies daddy or dead beat boyfriend and attempt to hook up with someone who they have "sized up" as being a great hunter. There must be something else involved, because your theory states everyone sizes up everyone on a superficial basis.

I get your point that most 23 year olds are jumping into bed with a 50 year old because he is hot, they wouldn't have those jokes that circulate with fat guy and the hot chick walking arm in arm with the question can you spot the rich guy, but most non providers/nonstrippers may size a guy up but it comes from a far less manipulative and cynical point of reference.

I like wisdom and challenging conversation. I like a way of thinking different than my own. I like hearing about a tough obstacle, and hearing how it was handled. I'd rather learn from the mistakes of others, than to make them on my own. It isn't always possible, but it's just how I try to look at things. Originally Posted by PleasantSurprise

SD as mentor. Originally Posted by woodyboyd

I think many opportunities are missed to learn from those around us/them. Myself included at times.

A lot can be learned from anyone with whom we cross paths...

may it be from a SD, friend/family member, random stranger who drums up a conversation,

or simply through silence and observation.

I think you guys take this to heart and need to turn your computer off sometimes.

I have as much authority as the Pope, I just don't have as many followers.

Sizing me up in what ways. Originally Posted by oktome

Good question.

Because I a good hunter and can bring home food. Think about this for a second. If what you say is true and I know from your perspective it is, why is it then that young females in this business are often around men who make more, are better educated, and in higher levels of society don't immediately drop their babies daddy or dead beat boyfriend and attempt to hook up with someone who they have "sized up" as being a great hunter. There must be something else involved, because your theory states everyone sizes up everyone on a superficial basis. Originally Posted by oktome

Your question of why would a female would choose for herself and / or her offspring a male with less resources when a male with considerably more resources and social standing is offered is a completely legitimate question since it seems it is counterintuitive.

• I read a book called “The Human Animal”. One of the studies in that book, and forgive me, I can’t find my copy so I can’t site it, has shown that women of breeding ages when presented with a good looking, verial (sp) male in his breeding years puts more weight on his looks and therefore his ability to breed than his resources.
• Another explanation is they love their SO’s, or they have children with them and are therefore tied to them emotionally because they love them or because they don’t want to break up their family. Both are completely legitimate reasons.
• Or the old standby that people will never let you down if you understand and accept as a fact that people will act counter to their needs and benefit on a constant and continual basis.
  

I get your point that most 23 year olds are jumping into bed with a 50 year old because he is hot, they wouldn't have those jokes that circulate with fat guy and the hot chick walking arm in arm with the question can you spot the rich guy, but most non providers/nonstrippers may size a guy up but it comes from a far less manipulative and cynical point of reference. Originally Posted by oktome

No offense, but wouldn’t count on that. People want the best they can have and that is true in a mate. You want the highest value female, so why is it cynical to think that women want the highest value male they can attract. It only makes sense. Otherwise, your last sentence could easily be flipped to say that ….but most non-dawgs / non-cocksmen may size a gal up, but it comes from a far less manipulative and cynical point of reference and that’s why they pick fat, ugly, uneducated and poor women that have had hysterectomies to marry even so they are dashing, smart, handsome, educated and wealthy.

I think you guys take this to heart and need to turn your computer off sometimes. Originally Posted by Gotyour6

Says the guy who double-dog dared us to come see how he spoils his twenty year old sugar baby this weekend. Okie-dokie

Says the guy who double-dog dared us to come see how he spoils his twenty year old sugar baby this weekend. Okie-dokie Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

Lol,
Its an offer sweet pea.

I am telling you that I am going to show you what its about.

You people that are dissecting this to death to prove you COULD be a sugar baby need to mellow the fuck out.

The funny part is that I will get no one that wants to see what it is about... Why you ask, Because there is nothing in it for you but knowledge and you want money.

That is what separates a hooker from a sugar baby as well.
Good luck Princess

Keep on providing, I am sure a sugar daddy will come alone and sweep you off your feet.
Maybe post in your little blog you want to get out of the business and settle down with a rich guy lol